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View Full Version : Smallest ATX chassi? PC-V650?



brutalizer
08-21-2013, 09:06 PM
I am looking for the smallest ATX chassis. It should hold at minimum 1-2 disks, a decent gaming graphics card and silent cpu cooler. The thing is, I dont want huge ATX chassis anymore. The trend goes towards smaller chassis.

I looked at the PC-V650 but it is discontinued. It would have been perfect if it had cable management behind the motherboard, it is ok if the chassis is slightly wider to get cable management, that is a good trade off. There are some minor flaws, if you read newegg reviews:
LIAN LI PC-V650B Black Aluminum ATX Mini Tower Computer Case - Newegg.com (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811112385)
"The mounting of the mobo is incorrect and located it the wrong place you can not use air cooling except oem cooling. Any good cooler will hit the psu. The mobo has a cut out for the cpu cooling solution but it is in the wrong place and the mounting will not allow you to get to the mounting holes. Tried to send Lian Li pictures of what is wrong but the e-mail they sent me will not work. There is a lot of wasted space in here, they could have made this a nice little cube if they wanted."

"The mother board is mounted in the wrong position, it needs to be 1/2" higher up in the chassis. The cut out for the cpu is 1" too far back in the chassis. These mistakes makes it not possible to use a good cpu cooler, you have to take the mobo out all the time because the cpu cut out covers the mounting holes on one side of the mounting. For what you pay for this thing you would think they could make it workable and correct. Now newegg needs to take back my new HE01 cooler. Realy dissapointing. Where is the quality control on this product."

Will Lian Li release a upgraded version of PC-V650 soon? Or plans on a small ATX case? I am going to build a small and silent Supermicro Xeon workstation very soon.

brutalizer
08-21-2013, 09:14 PM
Another thing, many people are using a PC stand so the PC hangs under the table. The PC is mounted just under the table like this:
http://www.dustinhome.se/image/917172

So, I can not buy chassis where the USB connections are on the top, on the roof. Please consider this when you design new chassis?

PS. I dont post on the other forum extremetech, because it cost money to register there.

brutalizer
08-21-2013, 09:18 PM
PS. the PC-V650 is a really sexy chassis, if you just fixed the minor flaws (cable management, move the mobo to align better), it would be a real killer for those who want the smallest ATX case.

Tyler.Bernath
08-21-2013, 09:22 PM
I must say I am slightly confused by your previous post's. Are you looking for a chassis? or did you already purchase the PC-V650 from Lian Li and are now unhappy with it?

brutalizer
08-21-2013, 09:29 PM
I am looking for the smallest ATX chassis. I have looked at the PC-V650 but reviews on newegg says the PC-V650 has some flaws. The PC-V650 has also been discontinued, but can still be found at some vendors.

Is Lian Li going to fix those flaws and release an upgraded version of PC-V650? If not, will Lian Li release soon small ATX chassis? Would be great if I knew so I can plan my workstation Xeon Supermicro.

Was this clearer?

Tyler.Bernath
08-21-2013, 09:39 PM
Thank you for the reply, I have no knowledge if Lian li will update their chassis or not but there are other options. Look at the PC-a05fnb or cooler master elite 360 even the PC-a55b.

Lian Li Tech
08-22-2013, 12:13 PM
Hey Brutalizer,

The PC-V650 is near end of production, so it will unlikely be restocked by Newegg. As for plans to update the V650, there is nothing in the works now.

If you are looking for a smaller ATX case that is currently available on Newegg, I would recommend the PC-A05FNB (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811112331). The PC-A55 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811112376) is also a small ATX case, but it is currently out of stock. BTW, a lot of times when Newegg says "discontinued", it just means out of stock. :)

I do agree with you on the trend for smaller and smaller chassis. While full towers are awesome to have and easy to work with, for mainstream use they are not necessary.

brutalizer
08-22-2013, 05:37 PM
Hey Brutalizer,

The PC-V650 is near end of production, so it will unlikely be restocked by Newegg. As for plans to update the V650, there is nothing in the works now.

If you are looking for a smaller ATX case that is currently available on Newegg, I would recommend the PC-A05FNB (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811112331). The PC-A55 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811112376) is also a small ATX case, but it is currently out of stock. BTW, a lot of times when Newegg says "discontinued", it just means out of stock. :)

I do agree with you on the trend for smaller and smaller chassis. While full towers are awesome to have and easy to work with, for mainstream use they are not necessary.
Do you have plans to release another small ATX case soon? I can still buy a PC-V650, they are still available at some places. The PC-V650 is smaller than the PC-A05FNB, so I might buy the V650 instead. The V650 could be the ultimate small case, if the flaws where corrected. Best in class, it could be.

Lian Li Tech
08-22-2013, 06:20 PM
There will not be a smallish ATX case coming out soon. It does seem like you have your heart set on the V650, so if that is what you are feeling go for it.

Im curious though. Since you are looking for a small case, why not go for M-ATX or M-ITX?

brutalizer
08-22-2013, 07:05 PM
There will not be a smallish ATX case coming out soon. It does seem like you have your heart set on the V650, so if that is what you are feeling go for it.

Im curious though. Since you are looking for a small case, why not go for M-ATX or M-ITX?
I want a full sized ATX mobo, because smaller form factors lack in functionality (PCIe slots, etc). I am going for a small Supermicro Xeon ECC workstation build. To it I will connect a 16-24 disk DAS with a sff-8088 cable whenever I need storage. Later I might want to expand with more cards, like the Xeon Phi compute node or so. A small mobo might not have all slots that I need.

The V650 could be the perfect case, if it had better cable manegement and the mobo moved up a bit. That is why I am slightly hesitant. The cpu cooler is a concern because it will easily hit the PSU, because the mobo needs to move a bit. I need to find a good cpu cooler and dito PSU combo that will power a Haswell Xeon. Do you happen to know such a combo?

brutalizer
08-23-2013, 03:56 AM
Thank you for the reply, I have no knowledge if Lian li will update their chassis or not but there are other options. Look at the... PC-a55b.
Dang! The PC-A55B would be nice, but it has the USB connections on the top. As I wrote earlier:

"Another thing, many people are using a PC stand so the PC hangs under the table. The PC is mounted just under the table like this:"
http://www.dustinhome.se/image/917172

So I can not use the PC-A55B. Lian Li, can you please consider this when you design new cases in the future? Put the connections on the front, not on top? I worked at large Fortune 500 companies, and many of the PCs are hanging down under the table, so that rules the PC-A55B out. Sure, Fortune 500 companies will not buy DIY PCs, but still. That can be an issue.

Tyler.Bernath
08-23-2013, 04:00 AM
You can just as easily purchase a bay device that will put USB ports on the front.

Lian Li Tech
08-23-2013, 12:57 PM
You could go with an 140mm AIO liquid cooling kit, ex. Corsair H90.

brutalizer
08-23-2013, 05:17 PM
You could go with an 140mm AIO liquid cooling kit, ex. Corsair H90.
Hmm... Reviews says it is a good cooler. Would it work with a E3 Xeon Haswell?

Actually, I thought of postponing my buy, and waiting for a small ATX case, just like the PC-V650 where the flaws are fixed. Main problem is the cpu cooler hitting the PSU. But now when I read about the H90, it seems to be a small cooler, and it will not hit the PSU, right? Ok, the question now is if it works with Xeon Haswell? If it does, I might go for a V650. Hmmm...

PS. Thanks for the tips! I have never considered water cooler. Is water cooler difficult to install, does it require much maintenance (fill up new water every week, wipe the mobo dry every week, etc)?

PPS. Do you know of any other small cpu coolers that would fit a LGA1150 and PC-V650? Even water based? So I can choose.

profJim
08-23-2013, 05:47 PM
Check into downdraft air coolers instead of tower type upright coolers.
For example: Noctua.at - sound-optimised premium components "Designed in Austria"! (http://www.noctua.at/main.php?show=produkte&lng=en) - NH-C14, NH-C12P SE14 or NH-L12
Noctua provides detailed size specs in each models' datasheet.
Motherboard compatibility is listed for most or all of the models.

Several other manufactures offer downdraft coolers.

brutalizer
08-23-2013, 06:01 PM
Check into downdraft air coolers instead of tower type upright coolers.
For example: Noctua.at - sound-optimised premium components "Designed in Austria"! (http://www.noctua.at/main.php?show=produkte&lng=en) - NH-C14, NH-C12P SE14 or NH-L12
Noctua provides detailed size specs in each models' datasheet.
Motherboard compatibility is listed for most or all of the models.

Several other manufactures offer downdraft coolers.
Wow! Great info! Thanks! :) I will look into downdraft air coolers that might fit the PC-V650. So, I need a downdraft cooler, and can not look at tower type upright coolers, right? Downdraft coolers might fit. And also water coolers.

I also need a list of PSUs that will fit the PC-V650, right? Does anyone know a good 500 W psu >90% efficiency that will fit?

Great info here. :)

Lian Li Tech
08-23-2013, 06:04 PM
Brutalizer,

Yes, on AIO watercooling kits the part that mounts to the CPU is much smaller than say your standard CPU cooler. So it will have no problem fitting. As for fitting on Xeon Haswell, there is no issue as it has the same socket as a i7 or i5 Haswell.

Most water cooling kits like the H90 require no maintenance for several years. This and their easy setup it part of the reason why they have been growing in popularity. They are (if you excuse the marketing term) pretty much plug-and-play.

profJim did give some examples of non-liquid cooling. If you want another example of a 140mm liquid cooling kit you could check out the NZXT Kraken X40. I believe it does have a bit larger radiator though than the Corsair, so it might interfere with the PSU.

Hope this helps.

profJim
08-23-2013, 06:16 PM
Check out reviews for air and water cooling setups.
Noise might be a problem at times with some or most water cooling setups.
Overall cooling will probably be somewhat better with higher priced water cooling kits.

brutalizer
08-25-2013, 07:20 AM
Thanks guys. I have read a bit, and it seems there are small coolers available. Which cooler would you use on the PC-V650, and why? Which one do you recommend?

I think I am going for the PC-V650, because it is so damn sexy. Major concerns is cable management and Cooler hitting cpu, but I will not have many cables in the case, so airflow will be fine. There are small cpu coolers, apparantely, so V650 it will be. I think. Please help me finding a good cpu cooler?

brutalizer
11-25-2013, 07:44 AM
Ok guys, after your help, I am now deciding between Silverstone NT06-PRO cpu cooler, and the Noctua NH-C14. I am leaning towards the NH-C14, but wonder if it does fit in the case? It's height is 130mm. Silverstone height is 82 mm.

Silverstone:
SilverStone Technology Co., Ltd.- NT06-PRO (http://www.silverstonetek.com/product.php?pid=368)

Noctua:
Noctua.at - sound-optimised premium components "Designed in Austria"! (http://www.noctua.at/main.php?show=productview&products_id=37&lng=en&set=1)

What say you? Anyone know if they fit in the PC-V650?

profJim
11-25-2013, 09:11 AM
From your Noctua link:

http://www.noctua.at/images/faqs/nh_c14_fan_modes.jpg


"The NH-C14 brings top-flow cooling to a new level by offering an exquisite, uniquely flexible 140mm dual fan setup: The two supplied NF-P14 premium fans can be installed on top and underneath the fin-stack to configure the cooler for maximum performance in dual fan mode and either lower profile (105mm) or maximum component clearance in single fan modes. Bundled with the award-winning NT-H1 thermal compound and Noctua’s SecuFirm2™ multi-socket mounting system, the NH-C14 is a highly flexible, premium-class top-flow solution that further boosts the renowned quiet cooling performance of the much acclaimed NH-C12P series."

brutalizer
11-25-2013, 05:34 PM
So NH-C14 should fit into the PC-V650, right?

Lian Li Tech
11-27-2013, 10:53 AM
So NH-C14 should fit into the PC-V650, right?

Yes, both would fit. For the NH-C14, you would have to have just on the underside (i.e. low-profile mode).

brutalizer
12-27-2013, 06:18 PM
I bought the PC-V650 and I really like it. I have bought the Noctua NH-C14 and I use only the lower fan. It works fine. However, the chassis fans sounds too loud, so I need to replace them. Which fans should I buy instead? I am looking for some: good - high end, fans.

This guy says the 140mm Corsair AIR fans are good. Do you have any recommendations? I would need three 140mm fans, and one 120mm fan, right?
Watercooled Lian-Li PC-V650 [Build Log] (http://www.overclock.net/t/1316014/watercooled-lian-li-pc-v650-build-log)

EDIT: Or, could I just lower the rpm on the current fans? How would I do that?
And, I got a "buzzer" with the case. What is a "buzzer"?

EDIT2: The case I got has correct cut out hole for the back of the cpu. This hole is wrongly placed in the pic, but my revision of the case has a correctly placed cut out hole:
http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/LianLi/PC-V650B/images/install2.jpg

EDIT 3: How can I limit the RPM of the fans? Is there any button or something? They are loud. Do I need to buy new fans?

Lian Li Tech
12-31-2013, 03:01 PM
I bought the PC-V650 and I really like it. I have bought the Noctua NH-C14 and I use only the lower fan. It works fine. However, the chassis fans sounds too loud, so I need to replace them. Which fans should I buy instead? I am looking for some: good - high end, fans.

This guy says the 140mm Corsair AIR fans are good. Do you have any recommendations? I would need three 140mm fans, and one 120mm fan, right?
Watercooled Lian-Li PC-V650 [Build Log] (http://www.overclock.net/t/1316014/watercooled-lian-li-pc-v650-build-log)

EDIT: Or, could I just lower the rpm on the current fans? How would I do that?
And, I got a "buzzer" with the case. What is a "buzzer"?

EDIT2: The case I got has correct cut out hole for the back of the cpu. This hole is wrongly placed in the pic, but my revision of the case has a correctly placed cut out hole:
http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/LianLi/PC-V650B/images/install2.jpg

EDIT 3: How can I limit the RPM of the fans? Is there any button or something? They are loud. Do I need to buy new fans?

Hi Brutalizer,

If you are looking to replace the fans, there are two excellent roundups here on silentpcreview for 140mm fans: here (http://www.silentpcreview.com/article1345-page1.html) and here (http://www.silentpcreview.com/140mm_Fan_Roundup2).

As there is no fan controller on the PC-V650, fan speed would be by changing the voltage via either the BIOS or software that comes on your motherboard.

brutalizer
01-02-2014, 04:10 AM
Hi Brutalizer,

If you are looking to replace the fans, there is an two excellent roundups here on silentpcreview for 140mm fans: here (http://www.silentpcreview.com/article1345-page1.html) and here (http://www.silentpcreview.com/140mm_Fan_Roundup2).

As there is no fan controller on the PC-V650, fan speed would be by changing the voltage via either the BIOS or software that comes on your motherboard.
Thanks for your help. I bought the Corsair AIR TF140, but they are really loud. Maybe my mobo powers the fan too much, I should decrease the power to the fans so I can lower the RPM. I would prefer some manual regulator instead of software based, because I will run Unix operating system, and the software is most probably for Windows, not Unix. If you know of an elegant manual regulator, then please tell me.