View Full Version : Need guidance

yuri yavari
12-21-2002, 02:03 PM
I have just went from a dial up connection to a dsl connection. At the same time I bought a router and ethernet cards to network my two pc's. One pc has Winme,and the other has WinXP. I am having difficulty getting them to work,and basically dont understand the terminology. My ISP says that my dsl modem is configured as a router,even though only one pc can be connected to it, and I have to reconfigure the modem to disable the router functions or there will be conflicts. This whole deal has become mind boggling. Way too many terms such as Gateways,dns,static,dynamic,pppoe,etc that I dont understand. Could someone point me to some type of helpsite,or tutorial where I can get a basic understanding of this network stuff.I am currently over my head....Thanks.:)

12-21-2002, 02:57 PM
OK, first of all, do you have permission to hook up 2 computers to the DSL by the ISP? IF so you can go with something simple like a Hub/Switch and dont worry about the router.
If you dont, there will be some work ahead.

I have to reconfigure the modem to disable the router functions or there will be conflicts. This worries me. I dont see why you have to reconfigure the modem.
Also to configure your new router you will need a lot of info. But it should be relatively easy to get. Basically you have to set up the router so that it asks ISP of an IP address (Dynamic IP). And set it up where the PCs have constant IP addresses (Static IP)
Gateway is your router, and your PCs have go through it to get to internet.

I found a couple of sites that might help you.
They have answered these questions a lot more times that i did, so go check them out.

yuri yavari
12-22-2002, 10:53 AM
Thanks for the response. You seem to have a good working knowledge of this stuff so let me see if i can clarify my dilema.My modem was configured by the ISP. The tech said it is configured for PPPoE. The Linkmax manual says its a PPPoE modem.
After the dsl installation was complete,I checked each of my pc's to see if they were connecting. Each one worked fine.
I then proceed to set up the dsl router. One pc will work,and one will not. I call the ISP tech and he says my modem was configured for router operation,and it must be changed. The Linkmax modem manual says it has 3 modes of operation, Router,Bridge,and Classic.
The modem web based set up page lists more than 3 options. It lists 2 versions of a Bridge,as well as PPPoE. I assumed that the router option would be checked (since the ISP tech said it was configured as a router),but the PPPoE option was what was checked.
As long as the router is configured as a DCHP,it will allow one pc to work. If I change the config to PPPoE,it will not work. I get a "cannot connect, system is behind a firewall" nag message.
I think both the modem ,and the router have DCHP enabled,I believe this might be part of the problem.
Something has to be configured as PPPoE,because that is my protocol.just not sure which one it needs to be. sorry for the long post,and thanks for helping..:)

12-22-2002, 03:37 PM
Do the computers see eachother when connected to a router?

The modem web based set up page lists more than 3 options.
What are they?

I think both the modem ,and the router have DCHP enabled,I believe this might be part of the problem.
Did you try running the modem in classic mode and having the router run as DHCP?

As long as the router is configured as a DCHP,it will allow one pc to work. If I change the config to PPPoE,it will not work.
When running as PPPoE what IP are you assigning to the router?

yuri yavari
12-22-2002, 07:58 PM
"Do the pc's see each other?".....Dunno,All I have tried to do with each one is connect.

"Did you try running the modem in classis mode"?...No,after the first reconfig failed,I got paranoid and was afraid of messing things up. The ISP tech said unless I was network savy,I could lose everything by messing with it.

The 3 modes of operation are: USB,Ethernet bridge,and Ethernet router.
The setup page lists:bridged 1483, bridged llc,RFC routed,classic IP, PPPoe, NAT inbound.

In PPPoE mode,IP's are assigned automatically. All I am required to enter is a User name, and a Password.

My biggest stumbling block is figuring out of both devices need to be set for PPPoE,or just the router? and figuring out which DHCP to disable.
Thanks for the help.

12-23-2002, 06:21 AM
Ok, I'm back. :D Who's ready to take care of this? Please answer the following questions. Who's your ISP? Do they use PPPoE? (I can usually tell if I know who your ISP is). What DSL modem did they give you. (I know it's a Linkmax, but is there a modem #?) Lastly, what router do you have? Thanks

yuri yavari
12-23-2002, 08:47 AM
My ISP is a local rural telephone co-operative.

The ISP tech said I connect via PPPoE. He said its similar to a dial up,where I have to enter a user name,and password.

The modem is a Linkmax 300a . It is catagorized as a modem/router,but it only has one connection for a ethernet cable.

I have a Linksys 4 port router.

I am currently on dial-up as I lost my dsl modem when I tried to reconfigure it to disable the DHCP function. The router manual said you cannot have two DHCP servers on the same network. I disabled the modem DHCP and lost my connection. I cant access the web based set up screen to change it back.

I'm not sure if the modem is actually considered part of the network or not?.So I may have not needed to disable it. I tried a reset,but it didnt do any good..:)

12-23-2002, 08:56 AM
Just one more question. With this modem, you type in a browser to access the modem to change the configuration, right? Maybe they have it setup different. If so, what's the address you typed?

yuri yavari
12-23-2002, 11:04 AM gets me to the configuration page if the modem is working. Since it currently not working,typing in that addy gets a 'Page cannot be displayed" nag message.
I have yet to uncover what the modems addy is.All of the configuration was performed by the ISP tech,before handing me the modem.....

12-23-2002, 12:39 PM
Ok, what we need to do first is get the modem back to the way it was. What you'll have to do is run an ethernet cable directly from the modem to one of the computers. Lets do the Windows XP machine for simplicity.

Next, on the XP machine:
go to start --> control panel --> network connections

In here you should have a Local Area Connection
right click on it and go to properties.
in the middle, highlight internet protocol, click properties

set if for "use the following IP"

It should be set it for "use the following DNS"
leave primary and secondary DNS empty
click ok

close everything and re-boot

then see if you can access the modem's configuration
If so, undo the changes you made to the modem, and let me know

Also if you are able to undo the changes you made to the modem, after you save the modem settings, undo the changes to your computer that I just had you do. Then reboot. And try your connection like normal first.

Let me know.

yuri yavari
12-23-2002, 01:56 PM
Okay, I'll try it when I get home. One thing that has just occured to me. Re-reading the the modem manual, it says the modem comes with a "crossed" ethernet cable. I had to make one for the other pc. I think I might have made mine "straight". This might explain why that pc wouldnt work,and the other one did.
The only thing about that theory is that I tried that computer all by itself (after I made the cable) and it worked fine...

12-23-2002, 02:01 PM
Ok then, for the current time, use that cross over cable that came with the modem between it and the Windows XP machine. When we get the connection back the way it was, then we'll work with the router.

yuri yavari
12-23-2002, 02:31 PM
Okay.....Thanks for the help..I checked the cable that came with the modem yesterday, and thought it was "straight thru".
The manual says it should be "Crossed". Might be a manual typo who knows.....lol

yuri yavari
12-24-2002, 12:25 PM
Had to return the dsl modem to the phone co-op for a replacement. This one is supposed to be set up as a straight through modem.When connected just to the pc, the modem will not connect. when connected to the router,it will connect,but the router set up wizard says it cant find the modem........I must have some type of really fuxed up adsl modem.

yuri yavari
12-26-2002, 01:41 PM
I can get to the modem config page thru the dial up method.Not sure how it works,but I can get in.As of now,no combo of modem and router settings seems to do the trick.

12-30-2002, 12:54 PM
So wait, you've gotten a new modem from the ISP? Does it work like it did when you first got DSL setup? I mean without the router, like when you initially got it set up?

I can get to the modem config page thru the dial up method.Not sure how it works...

My question about this is, do you still access the modem through the IP If so, then you're not accessing it through a dial up. You have a valid ethernet connection to that modem.

yuri yavari
12-30-2002, 10:50 PM
I apologize for being such a pain.This set up ordeal is almost two weeks in the making,and I still can't get it to work.the whole ordeal about the dial up might have been some kind of anomoly,i am not sure.
My isp gave me a 3rd modem,sometimes the modem wont reset.This appears to be a hardware defect in the modem.Some of the other problems are USER error.The fact that the modem is also a router has caused lots of problems with the linksys router setup.The isp asked me not to reconfigure this modem,and try to use the linksys as a regular switch.I decided t try again to set the modem as a bridge.
At this time,I have one pc working through the router.The other one wont work.When it boots up,it obtains an address that it wont release. The addy is also not in the range of the DHCP server in the router.As usual,I'm cluelesss.

12-30-2002, 11:04 PM
Ah, good. I was going to have you set it to bridge mode, and use the router configured the way you have it. So that sounds good. the fact that you have one machine running through the router tells me that the modem and DSL connection are good, and the router is setup correctly. Plus that one machine is setup correctly. About the machine that is not working, what IP address is it getting?

yuri yavari
12-30-2002, 11:49 PM
Now it gets interesting...........lol
I will say that in the two weeks I have been fighting this mess,I have learned a lot.Probably much more that I would have if it just worked from the beginning.With that being said. I did have one pc working through the router in the very beginning,so I actually havent made much progress,just got back to square one.
When I do a winipcfg on the non working pc, I get the following addy : It should be something like
I cannot get it to release,and if I try to enter a static addy(thats in the range of the router dhcp server) it still will not connect.I must be overlooking something.The pc that is working is running ME,and the non working one is a dual boot with 98 and XP.
Thanks a ton for your patience. This has been a very trying ordeal.

12-31-2002, 01:16 AM
well, this one's gonna be easy. The IP that machine is getting is an autoconfig address. If that machine is setup to obtain an IP from a DHCP server, and is unable to. The NIC will use it's own.

Basically there are only a few causes of this problem. One is the ethernet cable. Make sure you have a straight through cable between the router and the computer. Also make sure it's a known good ethernet cable.

next, make sure your TCP/IP settings are correct. They should be set to obtain everything automatically. That's pretty much it, aside from re-installing TCP/IP itself.

But you said this machine is a dual boot, with Win98 and XP, it's unlikely that TCP/IP is corrupted on both.

The same goes for the NIC itself. It's unlikely that the drivers are corrupted on both OS's. But you could re-install the NIC drivers.

And in worst case, it's the actual NIC hardware. Which you would have to get a new one if it has failed.

yuri yavari
12-31-2002, 02:46 AM
Here is a bit more info..The pc did work with this cable.I downloaded mp3's with it connected directly to the modem.That was a few days ago.Whe I try and connect,
Windows xp gives me a "network cable unplugged" nag message.
The only other thing that I have noticed is that the working pc has a check box on the winipcgf page for IP routing enabled.The non working pc has this box grayed out.I am unsure how to change it,or of I need to.
One more thing.There are corresponding lights on the router for each port on the router.
When I turn off the working pc,those lites go out.
When I turn off the non-working pc,the same lites do not go out.they just continue to blink.

12-31-2002, 04:03 AM
That thing with the router lights and XP complaining about the network cable sounds like a bad ethernet cable. Make sure it is a straight through cable as opposed to a crossover cable.

As far as the "IP Routing" enabled thing when you run winipcfg. This is of course happening on the Win98 side. This is incorrect TCP/IP settings. My suggestion is that you remove TCP/IP from the network control panel, re-boot, re-install it, re-boot, and leave that as it is. That should be ok.

yuri yavari
12-31-2002, 06:38 AM
I just ohmed out each wire in the cable.they show good.I made the cable so I wanted to triple check it.With each connector side by side(with the spring clip pointing down)the wires follows the same color pattern.I believe this is correct for straight through.The cable did previously work,so I'm reasonably sure this is not the problem.I'll will play a bit more with the IP routing thing....Thanks.

yuri yavari
12-31-2002, 09:26 AM
I can now get the DHCP server table to show it has assigned a good addy to the pc,but it still wont connect.It appears to connect,then disconnect over and over.Maybe I bought a defective router????

12-31-2002, 10:04 AM
When you say it seems to connect and disconnect over and over what do you mean? Still the router and the operational machine are fine right?

yuri yavari
12-31-2002, 11:26 AM
Yes,the WinMEmachine, and the router are fine.When I boot in 98,sometimes I get that bogus addy that you explained and sometimes I get a good addy from the DHCP server on the router,but still no internet connection.The lites on the nic card,and router pulsate on and off.This machine is a dual boot with XP on it as well.If I boot up in XP,I get a network cable unplugged messages that clears then comes back,over and over.It is almost as though someone is physically unplugging the cable,then plugging it back in.I dont think it is a settings problem,because both operating systems are affected.If I boot up, and get a good addy from the router, it will show good in the DHCP server table,but I still have no internet connection.The whole connection appears to pulse on and off. This Soyo motherboard has a built in SiS Ethernet card,but I have never enabled it.Pretyy dar weird............lol

12-31-2002, 11:50 AM
If you can, try another NIC in that machine. If your mother board has a nic built on that's never been enabled, and you've been using an add-in card, try using the nic on the motherboard. Oro try another add-in card. That's pretty much what I'm down to.

yuri yavari
12-31-2002, 12:15 PM
HAHAHA......I know what you mean.This was supposed to take about 2 hours,not 2 days..:)
I have made so many changes,I am unsure how some of it works.I thought about just connecting the pc to the modem,but for some reason when this particular modem is in bridge mode,it wont connect without the router.this really doesnt sound right,but this is how its working anyway.Thanks for all of you time.I really appreciate it.

12-31-2002, 12:33 PM
No problems. Just so you know the reason your modem won't connect in bridge mode and connected directly to a computer is because it's not logging you in through PPPoE anymore. It's expecting you to do that through WinPoet or Windows XP's built in PPPoE.

12-31-2002, 12:42 PM
I had the same "network cable unplugged" prob with my Intel nic in my SE/XP dual boot and the prob was the XP drivers for it and the fact that it wasn't fully assembled to take advantage of all the chipset features so in SE where I could disable the cable check, in XP no provision is given to do the same. Another nic cured the prob. ;)

yuri yavari
12-31-2002, 01:54 PM
The confusing part is that the darn pc downloads mp3's if you remove the router. I have an onboard Sis Ethernet adapter.Guess I could see if that one will work.

yuri yavari
12-31-2002, 01:57 PM
No problems. Just so you know the reason your modem won't connect in bridge mode and connected directly to a computer is because it's not logging you in through PPPoE anymore. It's expecting you to do that through WinPoet or Windows XP's built in PPPoE.

Or in my case,the router is handling the PPPoE logging duities.....:)
I'll probably be bald when I'm done,but I will have learned something...lol

12-31-2002, 02:00 PM
You're exactly right, the way you have it setup, the router does the PPPoE. Do try the onboard Sis Ethernet Adapter.

yuri yavari
01-01-2003, 08:22 AM
My problem appears to be related to the auto config of the NIC speed. I was able to get to a drop down box and set the NIC at 10Mbps.This cleared up the problem. Can you explain how this works,and can I correct it somehow?.thanks

yuri yavari
01-06-2003, 10:57 PM
Okay,I finally got it working.After all of my other trials and tribulations,I triple checked my stuff and found I had wired one cable incorrectly.I overlooked this stuff 3 times before I finally caught it.I shall be more attentive to detail in the future.Thanks for the help..:)

01-07-2003, 01:14 AM
Excellent, good job :D

yuri yavari
01-07-2003, 04:10 AM
I'll give myself a "C" on this project.....:)