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Thread: GA-P35-DS3/Crucial Ballistix & BSODs




  1. #1
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    Default GA-P35-DS3/Crucial Ballistix & BSODs

    Hi,
    Hope someone can shed some light on this, it seems a helpful place.

    Brand new build:
    Intel Core 2 Duo E8200 2.66GHz
    GA-P35-DS3 mobo
    Crucial 2x1GB DDR2 1066MHz/PC2-8500 Ballistix Non-ECC Unbuffered CL5
    Corsair VX 550W PSU
    ... etc

    Ok, I'd probably not gone for Crucial if I'd read these forums first, but...
    Put this system together about 6 weeks ago, ran perfectly with all default BIOS settings for 3 weeks.
    Suddenly started getting BSODs, mostly obviously memory related. Eliminated bad drivers - it crashed when running from a Bart PE CD I had built with only Microsoft drivers.
    Don't believe it is overheating - added extra case fan, temperature monitors do not show anything alarming, components don't feel hot.
    Crashing up to 10 times per day at worst point.
    Pulled one stick of RAM - suddenly *seemed* to be stable. Ran memtest86+ on "bad" stick, showed an error straight away at the top of memory (0003FEEE668).
    Moved "bad" stick to another slot, same error. Hah! Just to be sure, ran memtest86+ on "good" stick. Showed exactly the same error at exactly the same location. Humm.
    Sniffed around various forums, there was talk of flashing BIOS to latest version. Was on version F11, flashed to F13i.
    Memtest86+ now shows no errors with both RAM sticks. Yippee! Must have found the problem.
    System ran for 24 hours fine, then started BSODing again. Powered down, ran Memtest86+. No errors. Ok, I didn't run all tests, but follow me...
    Ran Windows, got BSOD after a couple of hours, this time didn't power down, just rebooted into memtest. Showed a bunch of errors - not same as before in a single location but hundreds.
    Started fooling with DDR2 Overvoltage in BIOS. With all settings normal this shows RAM voltage at 2.240.
    Tried raising it 0.1 at a time eventually raising it to +0.5 and +0.1 on the (G)MCH.
    Memtest still showed errors. Changed Performance Enhance from Turbo to Standard. Now no errors.
    Changed it back to Turbo. No errors. Changed all voltages back to normal. No errors. Humm again.
    Thought I'd try something safe - reduced RAM speed to 800MHz (400x2), Voltages "normal", Turbo.
    Memtest no errors. Windows ran for 12 hours then BSOD.
    Rebooted into memtest, hundreds of errors. In all cases it was the lower byte of the 32 bit block with a single bad bit. Various memory locations.
    Went through BIOS again. Although I had set "normal" voltages, and previously this was causing BIOS to show 2.240, found that mysteriously now it was 1.9.
    Bumped it up +0.3, ran memtest - no errors. Booted windows again, within 12 hours BSOD.
    Now trying Standard Performance and non-interleaved (both sticks on single channel). This currently feels stable although it's only been running for 6 hours.

    Questions:
    1. What exactly does "Turbo" performance do? I found that I was getting memtest errors through half a dozen reboots when tweaking the voltage. As soon as I selected Normal instead of Turbo not a single error.
    2. I see from this post that you should set memory timings manually, is that correct? With auto SPD, Memtest86+ shows 5-5-5-15, CPUZ shows 5-5-5-18 on the memory tab.
    3. There seems to be this consistent behaviour - I get BSOD then:
    a) If I reboot Windows it crashes pretty soon after.
    b) If I power down instead and restart Windows it's stable.
    c) If I boot into memtest instead it shows errors. I tweak the BIOS until it stops showing errors, and then restore the tweaked settings - it still shows no errors and Windows is stable for a good while.
    i.e. the faults are "sticky" until something "major" changes (power down/performance change, maybe), then it seems to be fine for 12 hours or so.
    4. Could it be the dual channel interleave mode? It would be consistent with the single stick being stable.
    5. Or should I just give up on the Crucial sticks and buy something else?

    TIA
    Dave

  2. #2
    Lsdmeasap's Avatar
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    Default Re: GA-P35-DS3/Crucial Ballistix & BSODs

    Turbo should be off, it changes settings which you cannot see or guess what it is going to do. And since you already have to overclock 1066 ram to run to that speed, you always want that setting on standard.

    Dont ever go to +0.5 again! That is WAY to much, and crucial die below stock often already.

    YOu want to be running 2.1 or less, but with it being 1066 sticks here we are likely talking 2.1 being needed +0.3 = 2.1 as you likely already know. Are these the new single sided crucials? If so they may have spec voltage below 2.1 best to check and be sure.

    For 1066 you will need to set MCH to this range (+0.1 - 0.125 - 0.150)

    What are the settings you are trying? >>>
    Just a template I use to ask people there settings, pay no attention to the numbers in it, replace with yours

    Robust Graphics Booster___________ [Auto]
    CPU Clock Ratio ____________ [8]
    CPU Host Clock Control_ [Enabled]
    CPU Host Frequency (MHz)__________ [450]
    PCI Express Frequency (Mhz)_______ [102]
    C.I.A. 2__________________________ [Disabled]
    System Memory Multiplier (SPD)____ [2.00]
    DRAM Timing Selectable_______ SPD __ [Manual]
    Performance Enhance = [Standard]

    CAS Latency Time________________ ?
    Dram RAS# to CAS# Delay_________ ?
    Dram RAS# Precharge Delay_______?
    Precharge Delay (tRAS)__________ ?
    ACT to ACT Delay (tRRD)_________ ?
    Rank Write to READ Delay________ ?
    Write to Precharge Delay_________ ?
    Refresh to ACT Delay______________ ?
    Read to Precharge Delay__________ ?
    Static tRead Value_______________ 1-31
    Static tRead Phase Adjust________ 1-31

    System Voltage Control____ [Manual]
    DDR2 OverVoltage Control__ [+0.300V]
    PCI-E OverVoltage Control_ [+0.1V]
    FSB OverVoltage Control___ [+0.1V]
    (G)MCH OverVoltage Control [+0.1V]
    CPU Voltage Control_______ [1.25]


    Yes, you should set things manually, especially if you are not scared to do so. Auto is often less or too much, and can vary widely at different times

    As for the single stick working better then double, I would say that is likely because AUTO may be closer to being correct with only one stick in there

    I would suggest you get non crucial, but that is just me.

    I can help you try to get those sticks stable, but with you having pushed 2.4V thru them I would suggest you test them at stock on a different board to ensure you have not fried them already

  3. #3
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    Default Re: GA-P35-DS3/Crucial Ballistix & BSODs

    Thanks for your response. You're a busy guy!
    First, the system has been completely stable since I went to non-interleaved mode - over 24 hours, longer than any time since these BSODs started happening. Both sticks seem fine, memtest not showing any problems.
    You said "For 1066 you will need to set MCH to this range (+0.1 - 0.125 - 0.150)" - I only see one setting for (G)MCH and it only allows +0.1, +0.2 etc, so I don't understand those last two numbers.
    These are the sticks I'm using.
    Here are my settings - I'm currently running the memory at 800MHz, remember, because that was one of the things I tried to get it stable and I haven't yet gone back to 1066:

    Robust Graphics Booster___________ [Auto]
    CPU Clock Ratio ____________ [8]
    CPU Host Clock Control_ [Disabled]
    CPU Host Frequency (MHz)__________ [333]
    PCI Express Frequency (Mhz)_______ [Auto]
    C.I.A. 2__________________________ [Disabled]
    System Memory Multiplier (SPD)____ [2.40]
    DRAM Timing Selectable_______ SPD __ [Auto]
    Performance Enhance = [Standard]

    CAS Latency Time________________ 5
    Dram RAS# to CAS# Delay_________ 5
    Dram RAS# Precharge Delay_______5
    Precharge Delay (tRAS)__________ 18
    ACT to ACT Delay (tRRD)_________ 3
    Rank Write to READ Delay________ 3
    Write to Precharge Delay_________ 6
    Refresh to ACT Delay______________ 52
    Read to Precharge Delay__________ 3
    Static tRead Value_______________ 6
    Static tRead Phase Adjust________ 0

    System Voltage Control____ [Manual]
    DDR2 OverVoltage Control__ [+0.300V]
    PCI-E OverVoltage Control_ [Normal]
    FSB OverVoltage Control___ [Normal]
    (G)MCH OverVoltage Control [Normal]
    CPU Voltage Control_______ [1.225]

    When I was running the memory at 1066, the BIOS showed this instead:
    CAS Latency Time________________ 5
    Dram RAS# to CAS# Delay_________ 7
    Dram RAS# Precharge Delay_______7
    Precharge Delay (tRAS)__________ 24

    I didn't make a note of the other settings, but if you want I can try going back to 1066 and see what it shows.

    Thanks again - I really appreciate you trying to help.

  4. #4
    Lsdmeasap's Avatar
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    Default Re: GA-P35-DS3/Crucial Ballistix & BSODs

    Ahh yeah, sorry I forget often that not all boards have all voltage options. You will need then MCH .1 or .2 depending. If .1 is stable then fine, if not try .2, it is safe as long as your NB isnt super hot, which I doubt it would be

    You are going to have to put the DRAM timing selectable on Manual to set things yourself, otherwise AUTO will be used and as you see with 5-7-7-24 things will be way looser then need be

    I would use this for 800, 444-12 is likely possible (95%) because those are actually 800Mhz sticks overclocked and factory tested to reach 1066 at loose timings

    Robust Graphics Booster___________ [Auto]
    CPU Clock Ratio ____________ [8]
    CPU Host Clock Control_ [Disabled]
    CPU Host Frequency (MHz)__________ [333]
    PCI Express Frequency (Mhz)_______ [100]
    C.I.A. 2__________________________ [Disabled]
    System Memory Multiplier (SPD)____ [2.40]
    DRAM Timing Selectable_______ SPD __ [Manual]
    Performance Enhance = [Standard]

    CAS Latency Time________________ 4
    Dram RAS# to CAS# Delay_________4
    Dram RAS# Precharge Delay_______4
    Precharge Delay (tRAS)__________ 12
    ACT to ACT Delay (tRRD)_________ 3-4

    Rank Write to READ Delay________ 5-7 Start with 9-11 (this will likely work with any number 3-1X only testing last will show you which gives better bandwidth)

    Write to Precharge Delay_________ 3-5
    Refresh to ACT Delay______________ 38-42
    Read to Precharge Delay__________ 3-5
    Static tRead Value_______________ 7-10
    Static tRead Phase Adjust________ 0 Leave unadjusted or on Zero or 1-31

    System Voltage Control____ [Manual]
    DDR2 OverVoltage Control__ [+0.300V]
    PCI-E OverVoltage Control_ [Normal]
    FSB OverVoltage Control___ [+0.1V] << For stability
    (G)MCH OverVoltage Control [+0.1V] << For stability
    CPU Voltage Control_______ [1.225]

    And this for 1066 attempts

    Robust Graphics Booster___________ [Auto]
    CPU Clock Ratio ____________ [8]
    CPU Host Clock Control_ [Disabled]
    CPU Host Frequency (MHz)__________ [333]
    PCI Express Frequency (Mhz)_______ [100]
    C.I.A. 2__________________________ [Disabled]
    System Memory Multiplier (SPD)____ [3.20]
    DRAM Timing Selectable_______ SPD __ [Manual]
    Performance Enhance = [Standard]

    CAS Latency Time________________ 5
    Dram RAS# to CAS# Delay_________5
    Dram RAS# Precharge Delay_______5
    Precharge Delay (tRAS)__________ 15
    ACT to ACT Delay (tRRD)_________ 3-4
    Rank Write to READ Delay________ 9-11 May need 15-18
    Write to Precharge Delay_________ 3-6
    Refresh to ACT Delay______________ 42-52
    Read to Precharge Delay__________ 3-5
    Static tRead Value_______________ 7-10
    Static tRead Phase Adjust________ 0 Leave unadjusted or on Zero or 1-31

    System Voltage Control____ [Manual]
    DDR2 OverVoltage Control__ [+0.300V]
    PCI-E OverVoltage Control_ [Normal]
    FSB OverVoltage Control___ [+0.1V] << For stability
    (G)MCH OverVoltage Control [+0.1V] << For stability, may need the +0.2 for 1066
    CPU Voltage Control_______ [1.225]

  5. #5
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    Default Re: GA-P35-DS3/Crucial Ballistix & BSODs

    Thanks, I'll give those settings a shot and get back to you - if it crashes it will be soon!. What do you think about the fact that it's been stable since going to non-interleaved mode? Is it just coincidence or does it indicate something significant?

  6. #6
    Lsdmeasap's Avatar
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    Default Re: GA-P35-DS3/Crucial Ballistix & BSODs

    Why did you set them in incorrect slots? I would think that would be worse you should run them in matched pairs in the correct slots

    Some never get Crucial to work in GA boards, so I wish you luck. Some do so you should at least try

    And before you waste too much time, did you test those in a different board at stock to be sure the 2.4 did not fry them already?
    Last edited by Lsdmeasap; 06-18-2008 at 04:26 PM.

  7. #7
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    Default Re: GA-P35-DS3/Crucial Ballistix & BSODs

    Pretty sure they're not fried, system has been up now with no problems for 48 hours and I've been hammering it - haven't got another board to try them on anyway.
    Re the slots, it was just a guess. This problem only seems to occur when there's two sticks on the mobo. Each on its own seems OK. What's significant about two sticks? - only that they're interleaving, which in my mind is an opportunity to go wrong. So I stopped the interleaving and the problem *seems* to have gone away.
    I want to keep testing this as it is. If it goes a week without a blue screen then I'm convinced the memory is ok and the interleaving is the problem. Whether the settings you gave me fix the interleaving problem I will test then.
    Problem is this is my job - I'm a software developer and this is my main machine. I can't currently afford to have it blue screening and losing work, I've got a system to get out within a couple of weeks.

    Thanks again, I really appreciate your input.
    Dave

  8. #8
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    Default Re: GA-P35-DS3/Crucial Ballistix & BSODs

    They should always be run in same color slots. Not doing so is what should cause issues and errors or at the least would be a lot slower

    But yes, your tests would show you what is what. If running them not dual channel works for you and is fast enough for what you need that would be what you should use I would guess.

    But I personally would put them back in dual channel and test with the settings I gave you, as I think that is what would help more in stability then running them in unmatched slots

  9. #9
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    Default Re: GA-P35-DS3/Crucial Ballistix & BSODs

    Ok, I'm convinced I have a stable system here so I can always go back to it. I'm going to try going back to dual channel and implement your settings for 1066. I should know soon enough.

    Cheers,
    Dave

  10. #10
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    Default Re: GA-P35-DS3/Crucial Ballistix & BSODs

    Good luck With all of that! I am glad you did find you some stable area! I know how bad it can be when you cannot find stable ground, especially when you need it badly

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