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Thread: Can someone confirm my power supply is up the creek?!




  1. #11

    Default Re: Can someone confirm my power supply is up the creek?!

    Quote Originally Posted by dylan0451 View Post
    E7200 duo 9.5 multi 395fsb - 3.7ghz - 1.3250v bios, 1.295v cpu-z, 1.280v cpu-z load

    P35-DS3L - +0.1 all voltage bar mch which is +0.2
    Looking at those CPU voltages V-offset .03v and and V-droop .045v are very low. Did you do a V-droop modification???

  2. #12

    Default Re: Can someone confirm my power supply is up the creek?!

    What I said is every batch have its own operational VID (see table).
    It is impossible to INTEL to made a chip with zillions of transistors all exactly the same so, they use the batch and every batch have its own VID.
    So, in my case (see photo), the VID informed by my CPU to the mobo is 0.875v and 43% of this value (not conservative at all!) is approximately 1.25v.
    Then, let's suppose another E7200 batch with VID @ 0.975v - now this one and only this one will accept 1.39v maximum.
    But I can't use 1.39v without risk of stress my CPU.

    That is not a general recommended voltage, what you saw are the limit maximum and minimum that every motherboard maker must add in every board they sell.
    Engineering data can't be used without the correct interpretation, you know.
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  3. #13
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    Default Re: Can someone confirm my power supply is up the creek?!

    Quote Originally Posted by svcglobal View Post
    What I said is every batch have its own operational VID (see table).
    It is impossible to INTEL to made a chip with zillions of transistors all exactly the same so, they use the batch and every batch have its own VID.
    So, in my case (see photo), the VID informed by my CPU to the mobo is 0.875v and 43% of this value (not conservative at all!) is approximately 1.25v.
    Then, let's suppose another E7200 batch with VID @ 0.975v - now this one and only this one will accept 1.39v maximum.
    But I can't use 1.39v without risk of stress my CPU.

    That is not a general recommended voltage, what you saw are the limit maximum and minimum that every motherboard maker must add in every board they sell.
    Engineering data can't be used without the correct interpretation, you know.
    Nevertheless, the Absolute Maximum Voltage (VCC) for the E7200 is 1.45volts. I wouldn't recommend anyone ran it at that (not long term anyway), but that IS Intels specification.
    http://download.intel.com/design/pro...hts/318732.pdf
    PAGE 17

    Out of Interest - Have you checked your actual VID ie within the chips range to see how that compares to the box info, with :-

    Real Temp shows the actual VID, allowing you to know how could your silicon is.
    techPowerUp! :: Download Real Temp 2.70
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  4. #14

    Default Re: Can someone confirm my power supply is up the creek?!

    Part of the email just received from Mr. Roger Razinsky, Intel support engineer at Santa Clara, that answered for more info about VID interpretation:

    ""Each processor is programmed with a maximum valid voltage identification value (VID), which is set at manufacturing and can not be altered. Individual maximum VID values are calibrated during manufacturing such that two processors at the same frequency may have different settings within the VID range."
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  5. #15
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    Default Re: Can someone confirm my power supply is up the creek?!

    Quote Originally Posted by svcglobal View Post
    Part of the email just received from Mr. Roger Razinsky, Intel support engineer at Santa Clara, that answered for more info about VID interpretation:

    ""Each processor is programmed with a maximum valid voltage identification value (VID), which is set at manufacturing and can not be altered. Individual maximum VID values are calibrated during manufacturing such that two processors at the same frequency may have different settings within the VID range."
    .....that too is a quote from the data sheet ;) - nothing new there...

    The VID range for a given model is obviously wide enough to cater for what ever is churned out from the Intel production line.
    The VID is then interogated by the bios and the correct voltage is reported back so that chip can be supplied with the neccessary voltage to operate correctly.

    Obviously if your CPU has a low VID (within the products range), then you've got a quality chip.

    However according to Intel documetation Absolute maximum VCC remains the same for any given VID.
    Last edited by VorLonUK; 09-29-2008 at 09:36 PM.
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  6. #16
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    Default Re: Can someone confirm my power supply is up the creek?!

    I see you have 2x2GB and no one has mentioned BIOS settings, They can very often cause issues if left in Auto with 2x2GB and that could be your problem.

    Do you set them, or are they in Auto? If you set them, please post what they are and I will let you know if they should be working >>>

    This is Just a template I use to ask people their settings, pay no attention to the numbers in it, replace with yours

    Robust Graphics Booster___________ [Auto]
    CPU Clock Ratio ____________ [8]
    CPU Host Clock Control_ [Enabled]
    CPU Host Frequency (MHz)__________ [450]
    PCI Express Frequency (Mhz)_______ [100]
    C.I.A. 2__________________________ [Disabled]
    System Memory Multiplier (SPD)____ [2.00]
    DRAM Timing Selectable_______ SPD __ [Manual]

    Performance Enhance = [Standard]

    CAS Latency Time________________ ?
    Dram RAS# to CAS# Delay_________ ?
    Dram RAS# Precharge Delay_______?
    Precharge Delay (tRAS)__________ ?
    ACT to ACT Delay (tRRD)_________ ?
    Rank Write to READ Delay________ ?
    Write to Precharge Delay_________ ?
    Refresh to ACT Delay______________ ?
    Read to Precharge Delay__________ ?
    Static tRead Value_______________ 1-31
    Static tRead Phase Adjust________ [Auto]

    System Voltage Control____ [Manual]
    DDR2 OverVoltage Control__ [+0.300V]
    PCI-E OverVoltage Control_ [+0.1V]
    FSB OverVoltage Control___ [+0.1V]
    (G)MCH OverVoltage Control [+0.1V]
    CPU Voltage Control_______ [1.25]

    Limit CPUID Max. to 3.....................: [Disabled]
    No-Execute Memory Protect............: [Enabled]
    CPU Enhanced Halt (C1E)................: [Disabled]
    C2/C2E State Support....................: [Disabled]
    x C4/C4E State Support..................: [Disabled]
    CPU Thermal Monitor 2(TM2) ...........: [Enabled]
    CPU EIST Function.........................: [Disabled]
    Virtualization Technology................: [Disabled]

  7. #17
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    Default Re: Can someone confirm my power supply is up the creek?!

    I was under the impression that the VID was a voltage identification - just a recommended, tested working voltage and baseline from the factory, but the max warrantied voltage to run the chip at was 1.3625v

    Vorlon, indeed, I'm in essex, england - don't worry though the only hardware i've ever bought from pc world was a cdr-w drive years back!

    Lsdmeasap, current bios settings are as below, i followed your advice from the memory sticky, and so far since i lowered my fsb from 400 to 395 the memory passes atleast an hour of orthos and occt memory torture tests

    Robust Graphics Booster___________ [Auto]
    CPU Clock Ratio ____________ [9]
    Fine CPU Clock Ratio ____________ [0.5]
    CPU Host Clock Control_ [Enabled]
    CPU Host Frequency (MHz)__________ [395]
    PCI Express Frequency (Mhz)_______ [100]
    C.I.A. 2__________________________ [Disabled]
    System Memory Multiplier (SPD)____ [2.00]
    DRAM Timing Selectable_______ SPD __ [Manual]

    Performance Enhance = [Standard]

    CAS Latency Time________________ 5
    Dram RAS# to CAS# Delay_________ 5
    Dram RAS# Precharge Delay_______5
    Precharge Delay (tRAS)__________ 18
    ACT to ACT Delay (tRRD)_________ 3 [auto]
    Rank Write to READ Delay________ 3 [auto]
    Write to Precharge Delay_________ 6 [auto]
    Refresh to ACT Delay______________ 52
    Read to Precharge Delay__________ 3 [auto]
    Static tRead Value_______________ 8 [auto]
    Static tRead Phase Adjust________ 0 [auto]

    System Voltage Control____ [Manual]
    DDR2 OverVoltage Control__ [+0.1V]
    PCI-E OverVoltage Control_ [+0.1V]
    FSB OverVoltage Control___ [+0.1V]
    (G)MCH OverVoltage Control [+0.2V]
    CPU Voltage Control_______ [1.3250V]

    Limit CPUID Max. to 3.....................: [Disabled]
    No-Execute Memory Protect............: [Disabled]
    CPU Enhanced Halt (C1E)................: [Disabled]
    C2/C2E State Support....................: [Disabled]
    x C4/C4E State Support..................: [Disabled]
    CPU Thermal Monitor 2(TM2) ...........: [Enabled]
    CPU EIST Function.........................: [Disabled]
    Virtualization Technology................: [Disabled]


    anything seem odd? any of those setting i've left on auto that should be changed?

    the ram didn't work with those settings at it's full speed but i didn't want to relax them anymore hence i lowered the fsb and it seems to run fine at 790mhz

  8. #18

    Default Re: Can someone confirm my power supply is up the creek?!

    Quote Originally Posted by svcglobal View Post
    That is not a general recommended voltage, what you saw are the limit maximum and minimum that every motherboard maker must add in every board they sell.
    Engineering data can't be used without the correct interpretation, you know.
    This is correct. This range is the minmum and maximum recommended. Does Intel recommending a lower maximum voltage on the box surprise you??? They also do not recommend overclocking and state that it voids the warranty.

    If a processor can run stable at the high maximum range, which most Core2 processors seem to do easily, with less than maximum temperartures it is running fine. The CPU life span is probably reduced but it should last at least three years with the temps its running.

    Stressing computer parts is a personal decision with many exceeding recommended limits. In this case the voltage is in the high range but within Intel limits.

  9. #19
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    Default Re: Can someone confirm my power supply is up the creek?!

    Quote Originally Posted by Merman View Post
    Looking at those CPU voltages V-offset .03v and and V-droop .045v are very low. Did you do a V-droop modification???
    haven't done any mods to the board - are they good figures? i thought they were a little mediocre but thats good atleast!

    when i get the power supply through I'll see if i can get the cpu voltage any lower

    running 400fsb - 3.8ghz needed 1.3650v and max temps were 60-65c

    now, running 395fsb - 3.750ghz needs only 1.3250v (maybe less) and max temps are now 55-59c

  10. #20

    Default Re: Can someone confirm my power supply is up the creek?!

    Quote Originally Posted by VorLonUK View Post
    .....that too is a quote from the data sheet ;) - nothing new there...

    The VID range for a given model is obviously wide enough to cater for what ever is churned out from the Intel production line.
    The VID is then interogated by the bios and the correct voltage is reported back so that chip can be supplied with the neccessary voltage to operate correctly.

    Obviously if your CPU has a low VID (within the products range), then you've got a quality chip.

    However according to Intel documetation Absolute maximum VCC remains the same for any given VID.
    For the most part this is correct. As pointed out VID is dynamic and there is no set point. The term VID in the BIOS is to set a high point for voltage spike when comming off load. In the mean time the voltage is going up and down many times a second, which is not shown in the reporting programs.

    As definded in the Voltage Regulator Down specification in section 1.2 Terminology:


    Vcc Processor core voltage defined in the processor datasheet.

    VID Voltage Identification: A code supplied by the processor that
    determines the reference output voltage to be delivered to the
    processor Vcc lands. At zero amperes and the tolerance band at + 3-
    σ,

    VID is the voltage at the processor.

    http://www.intel.com/assets/pdf/designguide/313214.pdf


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