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Thread: E8400 and UD3R help to 4ghz




  1. #31
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    Post Re: E8400 and UD3R help to 4ghz

    Quote Originally Posted by morph View Post
    Hey, I was just wondering.. did you guys ever had the following problem: if setting MCH and CPU references to Auto system if unable to POST, no matter what VTT (tryed from 1.1V to 1.32V) but when setting manual, every value from the .7-.8 range can POST but is instable in windows.
    I'm asking because I've seen almost everywhere over the forum advices as to use those both with auto, as it's set correctly that way.
    CPU Ref it seems most people can leave on auto safely (including me), but MCH Ref 100% for me has to be lower than .760 (more like .700 to .740) for stability. Using .700 right now at 533x8 and no problems.

  2. #32
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    Default Re: E8400 and UD3R help to 4ghz

    Agreed. The standard advice is to try both on auto first. However as you increase clock speed (with E8xxx's the trend is after 3.6-3.8GHz) a lower MCH ref is required. It can mean the difference between Prime failing instantly at say 0.760V MCH Ref @ 1.2VTT to complete stability two notches lower at 0.720V @ 1.2VTT. As KayossZero proves, along with D-an-W and his E8xxx series, even lower MCH Ref may be needed at high clocks and FSB.
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  3. #33
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    Default Re: E8400 and UD3R help to 4ghz

    Damn I hate that MCH Reference. I've tryed every value in between .70 to .80 and everything resulted in a almost instant restart in prime or other stabillity test. I've used tons of other voltage combinations, nothing seemed to work.
    So finally I lowered MCH Ref to .65 with 1.22 VTT and right now I'm 30 minutes stable in orthos small fft. I know it's still a long way to 4GHz fully stable and lowest voltages, but for me it's a huge step. Never got to over 2 minutes of stabillity at this clock, and I've been strugling for over one week. And when I think it was just that damn MCH Ref
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  4. #34
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    Default Re: E8400 and UD3R help to 4ghz

    Yep, MCH ref is like voodoo.

    For such a high clock, Vcore, Vtt and MCH ref need to be finely tuned for definite. Also, if running with a high FSB and a lowered multi in particular, MCH Core voltage is very important, along with DRAM Driving Strength and Static tRead. Even sub timings and VDIMM can make a difference at high FSB speeds, sometimes regardless of whether the RAM is running at or under its rated speed
    Coolermaster CM 690 II advance Case
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    2 x 2GB Mushkin Ridgeback (996902), @ 7-10-8-27, 2010-DDR, 1.66v
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  5. #35
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    Default Re: E8400 and UD3R help to 4ghz

    Updated the graph to include 2 new observations. Keep them coming.

    Last edited by BoombasticSloth; 07-01-2009 at 09:12 AM. Reason: updated with a second data entry for 1.25vid and 1.35 vcore
    1) Gigabyte EP45-UD3P (rev 1.1, bios F9) E8400 @445x9@1.2625v bios, TRUE 120, Scythe UltraKaze 44cfm, 4x2gb GSkill 8500, Visiontek 3870, Corsair TX850, Antec 900, Win7-64 Home.
    2) Gigabyte EP45-UD3P (rev 1.1, bios F9) E8400 @500x8.5@1.2875v bios, TRUE 120, Schythe UltraKaze 44 cfm, 4x2gb Buffalo FireStyx 8500, XFX 5770, Corsair AX850, CM Scout, WinXP Pro/Win 7-64 Home.
    3) Gigabyte P55A-UD4P (rev 1.0, bios F5) i5 750 @190x20@1.30625v bios, CM Hyper 212+, 4x2gb G.Skill Ripjaw 1600, 7900GS, Corsair TX750, CM Scout, Win7 Pro-64.
    4) Asus P8Z68-V Pro (bios 0801), i5-2500K @44x100@1.248v cpuz, Megahalem rev.B, 4x4gb GSkill Sniper 1600, Corsair AX850, Antec 902, Corsair Performance 3 128GB, Win7-64 Home.


  6. #36
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    Default Re: E8400 and UD3R help to 4ghz

    Your formula actually seems correct. I'm not yet fully p95 blend stable, but small fft seems pretty stable with 1.312V as shown by CPU-Z (1.337 set in BIOS with LLC enabled) for a 1.25VID E0.
    LE: hehe, just noticed, my vcore is l33t.
    LLE: Well, for now I'm small fft 2 hours stable with as low as 1.2V VTT and 0.70 MCH Ref.
    Blend still seems to fail. Either rounding error at lower MCH Ref (0.64-0.66), or reboots during testing with Ref set higher (0.70-0.74). I've also tryed VTT from 1.2 to 1.28 with the 0.64-0.74 Ref range. I thought it might be the MCH Core so I upped that to 1.32 but same thing. I don't wanna go higher with that, as I'm sure it's pretty high for a 24/7 445FSB. I've also used 1.55, 1.57, 1.59 and 1.61 PLL. I've also tryed Memtest tests 2,5,7,8 passed without errors. So, for now I'm pretty stuck.
    I'll might let prime small fft over night, or at least a couple more hours, just to make sure that vcore is high enough and reduce the problem to something else.
    Last edited by morph; 06-30-2009 at 06:27 AM.
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  7. #37
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    Default Re: E8400 and UD3R help to 4ghz

    morph, I'd be cautious but decisive if I were you, and set a 1.3500Vcore with LLC and see if that gives you more stability. Even go for 1.3625V if temps are good. Obviously work your way down if stable, but this will certainly eliminate the CPU as a stability problem. That then leaves the MCH (both Ref and Core voltages) and RAM (VDIMM, timings, driving strength).

    Small FFT isn't always a sure fire CPU stability thing. I've had instances where the PC will do small FFT forever and a day, but fail large FFT, needing a Vcore bump to be stable.

    I would also consider using a RAM multi or FSB that keeps your RAM closer to its rated speed. It may be fully stable at 1066, but as it's not tested to that it may not be.

    Edit: Just noticed how much like GSkill those A-Data modules look. Similar logo and colour scheme used.
    Last edited by Psycho101; 06-30-2009 at 06:42 AM.
    Coolermaster CM 690 II advance Case
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    2 x 2GB Mushkin Ridgeback (996902), @ 7-10-8-27, 2010-DDR, 1.66v
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  8. #38
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    Default Re: E8400 and UD3R help to 4ghz

    The voltage values given in the sample are the bios cpu voltages. Cpu-Z would be lower.

    I am not sure if it will help you but below are my settings for my 4ghz setup and has 4x2gb rams.

    Code:
    E8400 445 X 9 = 4005 MHz F9 BIOS
    
    Robust Graphics Booster.........................[ Auto ]
    CPU Clock Ratio.................................[ 9 ]
    Fine CPU Clock Ratio............................[ 0.0 ]
    CPU Frequency 4.0GHz............................[445 x 9.0]
    
    ******Clock Chip Control******
    
    CPU Host Clock Control..........................[ Enabled ]
    CPU Host Frequency (Mhz)........................[ 445 ]
    PCI Express Frequency (Mhz).....................[ 100 ] 
    C.I.A 2 ........................................[Disabled]
    
    ******Advanced Clock Control******
    
    CPU Clock Drive.................................[ 800mv ]
    PCI Express Clock Drive.........................[ 900mv ]
    CPU Clock Skew..................................[ 0ps ]
    MCH Clock Skew..................................[ 0ps ]
    
    ******DRAM Performance Control******
    
    Performance Enhance ............................[Standard]
    Extreme Memory Profile (XMP)....................[Disabled]
    (G) MCH Frequency Latch.........................[ auto ] 
    System Memory Multipler.........................[ 2.00D ]
    Memory Frequency 1066...........................[ 890]
    DRAM Timing Selectable..........................[ Manual ]
    
    CAS Latency Time................................[ 5 ]
    tRCD............................................[ 4 ]
    tRP.............................................[ 4 ]
    tRAS............................................[ 12 ]
    
    ******Advanced Timing Control******
    
    tRRD............................................[ Auto ]
    tWTR............................................[ Auto ]
    tWR.............................................[ Auto ]
    tRFC............................................[ Auto ] 
    tRTP............................................[ Auto ]
    Command Rate (cmd)..............................[ 2 ] 
    
    
    **************************************
    
    Driving Strength Profiles
    Driving Strength ...............................[ 1066 ]  
    
    Channel A
    Static tRead Value..............................[ 10 ]  
    tRD Phase0 Adjustment...........................[Auto]
    tRD Phase1 Adjustment...........................[Auto]
    tRD Phase2 Adjustment ..........................[Auto]
    tRD Phase3 Adjustment...........................[Auto]
    
    Trd2rd(Different Rank)..........................[Auto]
    Twr2wr(Different Rank)..........................[Auto]
    Twr2rd(Different Rank)..........................[Auto]
    Trd2wr(Same/Diff Rank)..........................[Auto]
    
    Dimm1 Clock Skew Control........................[Auto]
    Dimm2 Clock Skew Control........................[Auto]
    DDR Write Training..............................[Auto]
    
    Channel B
    Static tRead Value..............................[ 10 ]  
    tRD Phase0 Adjustment...........................[Auto]
    tRD Phase1 Adjustment...........................[Auto]
    tRD Phase2 Adjustment ..........................[Auto]
    tRD Phase3 Adjustment...........................[Auto]
    
    Trd2rd(Different Rank)..........................[Auto]
    Twr2wr(Different Rank)..........................[Auto]
    Twr2rd(Different Rank)..........................[Auto]
    Trd2wr(Same/Diff Rank)..........................[Auto]
    
    Dimm1 Clock Skew Control........................[Auto]
    Dimm2 Clock Skew Control........................[Auto]
    DDR Write Training..............................[Auto]
    
    ******Motherboard Voltage Control******
    
    Load-Line Calibration ..........................[Disabled]
    CPU Vcore [ 1.20 ]..............................[ 1.2625 ]
    CPU Termination [ 1.20 ]........................[ 1.24 ]
    CPU PLL [ 1.50 ]................................[ 1.50 ] 
    CPU Reference [ 0.760 ].........................[ 0.77 ] 
    
    MCH Core [1.1 ].................................[ 1.20 ]
    MCH Reference [0.760 ]..........................[ 0.765 ]
    MCH/DRAM Reference [0.900 ].....................[ 0.96 ] 
    ICH I/O [1.500 ]................................[ 1.57 ] 
    ICH Core [1.100 ]...............................[ 1.20 ]
    
    DRAM Voltage [1.800 ]...........................[ 1.92 ] 
    DRAM Termination [0.900 ].......................[ 0.96 ] 
    Channel A Ref [0.900 ]..........................[ 0.96 ] 
    Channel B Ref [0.900 ]..........................[ 0.96 ] 
    
    ******Advanced BIOS Features******
    
    Limit CPUID Max to 3............................[ Disabled ]
    No-Execute memory Protect.......................[ Enabled ]
    CPU Enhance Halt (CIE)..........................[ Disabled ]
    C2/C2E State Support............................[ Disabled ]
    C4/C4E State Support............................[ Disabled ]
    CPU Thermal Monitor.............................[ Enabled ] 
    CPU EIST Function...............................[ Disabled ]
    Virtualization Technology.......................[ Disabled ]
    
    *******************************************
    1) Gigabyte EP45-UD3P (rev 1.1, bios F9) E8400 @445x9@1.2625v bios, TRUE 120, Scythe UltraKaze 44cfm, 4x2gb GSkill 8500, Visiontek 3870, Corsair TX850, Antec 900, Win7-64 Home.
    2) Gigabyte EP45-UD3P (rev 1.1, bios F9) E8400 @500x8.5@1.2875v bios, TRUE 120, Schythe UltraKaze 44 cfm, 4x2gb Buffalo FireStyx 8500, XFX 5770, Corsair AX850, CM Scout, WinXP Pro/Win 7-64 Home.
    3) Gigabyte P55A-UD4P (rev 1.0, bios F5) i5 750 @190x20@1.30625v bios, CM Hyper 212+, 4x2gb G.Skill Ripjaw 1600, 7900GS, Corsair TX750, CM Scout, Win7 Pro-64.
    4) Asus P8Z68-V Pro (bios 0801), i5-2500K @44x100@1.248v cpuz, Megahalem rev.B, 4x4gb GSkill Sniper 1600, Corsair AX850, Antec 902, Corsair Performance 3 128GB, Win7-64 Home.


  9. #39
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    Default Re: E8400 and UD3R help to 4ghz

    Psycho, thanx for the tip. I've always thought that if small fft was passing, vcore was about right. Seems i was wrong. With 1.35V and LLC enabled this 7 minutes is by far the most stable I've got so far. I think i could maybe decrease MCH core and possibly give VTT a small bump.

    @BoombasticSloth: thanks for the template, I'll try some settings from it. But I can't even post with anything lower than 1.275V vcore and need 1.3V just to load windows. Pretty strange as i was stable at 500x7.5 with 1.275V LLC disabled and all the other voltages just one notch or two higher.
    Last edited by morph; 06-30-2009 at 06:58 AM.
    GA-EP45-UD3R (F12)
    Zalman CNPS-7000C-CU
    E8400@3.6GHz
    2x2GB A-DATA Vitesta 800+ CL4 Extreme Edition @ 1066MHz@2.0V (5-5-5-15)
    Asus EN9800GT Ultimate @ 810/2000/2200
    Seagate 250GB + WD 500GB + WD 640GB
    Asus DRW 1608-P
    BenQ G2010WP
    Thermaltake TR2 500W
    Windows 7 Pro x64

  10. #40
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    Default Re: E8400 and UD3R help to 4ghz

    That is the thing about oc'ing. It is about finding the right combination that will work at a particular rated cpu speed. Psycho advocates using a spreadsheet to help with all the different bios combinations and that really is a good idea. This way you can identify which changes have been made and if there are any improvements. Then you can build on those combinations that work.
    1) Gigabyte EP45-UD3P (rev 1.1, bios F9) E8400 @445x9@1.2625v bios, TRUE 120, Scythe UltraKaze 44cfm, 4x2gb GSkill 8500, Visiontek 3870, Corsair TX850, Antec 900, Win7-64 Home.
    2) Gigabyte EP45-UD3P (rev 1.1, bios F9) E8400 @500x8.5@1.2875v bios, TRUE 120, Schythe UltraKaze 44 cfm, 4x2gb Buffalo FireStyx 8500, XFX 5770, Corsair AX850, CM Scout, WinXP Pro/Win 7-64 Home.
    3) Gigabyte P55A-UD4P (rev 1.0, bios F5) i5 750 @190x20@1.30625v bios, CM Hyper 212+, 4x2gb G.Skill Ripjaw 1600, 7900GS, Corsair TX750, CM Scout, Win7 Pro-64.
    4) Asus P8Z68-V Pro (bios 0801), i5-2500K @44x100@1.248v cpuz, Megahalem rev.B, 4x4gb GSkill Sniper 1600, Corsair AX850, Antec 902, Corsair Performance 3 128GB, Win7-64 Home.


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