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Thread: How Do I Get the Standard Speed From GA-EP45T-UD3LR?




  1. #11
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    Default Re: How Do I Get the Standard Speed From GA-EP45T-UD3LR?

    I'm really only aiming for a speed of 1333 for the RAM as I tried to say in the original post, not 1600 as the memory supports, but maybe I wasn't clear. My understanding is that matching the RAM speed to the FSB of the CPU, along with achieving harmony, is the optimum balance of performance and stability, correct?
    No.

    What speed the RAM is running at compared to the FSB means nothing. Absolutly nothing. As I say, at a RAM speed of DDR-1333 the modules are running at a true speed of 666MHz. For a FSB to achieve the oft quoted quad pummped, not real MHZ figure of 1333 it will be running at 333 actual MHz. As you can see 666MHz and 333MHz aren't the same. There is no benefit in matching frequencies, as what you think are matched frequencies, really are not.

    Get your CPU running the speed you want, or as fast as you want and run your RAM as close to its spec as you can. The myth of 1:1 RAM to FSB ratio's (or 1:2 is common too with DDR3) has no effect on a modern system. It did make a difference on older SDRAM and some DDR-SDRAM systems due to latency issues, but these days are long gone.

    To be honest, if you're not going to over clock, there's no way to get the RAM any higher in your config, you need to overclock with a 333 MHz FSB CPU for anything over 1333. You would have been better off with some decent DDR3-1333.
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  2. #12
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    Default Re: How Do I Get the Standard Speed From GA-EP45T-UD3LR?

    Quote Originally Posted by Psycho101 View Post
    No.

    What speed the RAM is running at compared to the FSB means nothing. Absolutly nothing. As I say, at a RAM speed of DDR-1333 the modules are running at a true speed of 666MHz. For a FSB to achieve the oft quoted quad pummped, not real MHZ figure of 1333 it will be running at 333 actual MHz. As you can see 666MHz and 333MHz aren't the same. There is no benefit in matching frequencies, as what you think are matched frequencies, really are not.

    Get your CPU running the speed you want, or as fast as you want and run your RAM as close to its spec as you can. The myth of 1:1 RAM to FSB ratio's (or 1:2 is common too with DDR3) has no effect on a modern system. It did make a difference on older SDRAM and some DDR-SDRAM systems due to latency issues, but these days are long gone.

    To be honest, if you're not going to over clock, there's no way to get the RAM any higher in your config, you need to overclock with a 333 MHz FSB CPU for anything over 1333. You would have been better off with some decent DDR3-1333.
    Thanks for the info. I am satisfied with how it's running at the moment.

    I realize I could have gone with cheaper memory, but this OCZ was the only memory I saw that was certified for the board at the time that offered the configuration I needed. I'm running some VM's and wanted to have 8 GB of RAM. I figured there might be some future-proofing with the OCZ, too, since it's DDR3 and a future system might have an FSB that would allow me to use all its potential.

    It's funny you mention those old, legacy systems in which the 1:1 or 1:2 ratio was important. I guess I qualify as an old legacy system myself, and learned that rule of thumb back then...

  3. #13

    Default Re: How Do I Get the Standard Speed From GA-EP45T-UD3LR?

    Knowing next to nothing about DDR3 I have a question. If DDR2 800 is really 400x2, how come DDR3 1333 is not 444x3 but is 667 x 2?

    And I will now never talk of harmony and synergy again, thanks for popping my metaphysical bubble, Psycho :p
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    Consider for a moment that what we think of as “intelligence” is the byproduct of a computing architecture that depends on massive parallelism to interact with the world in real time without stalling for progress bars. If our ancestors’ brains had depended on running Vista on current dual-core processors for their survival, they would have been eaten by bears.

    Best Quote Ever...
    Quote Originally Posted by Psycho101
    Obey the one and only rule without question when you overclock.... don't cause a fire. Fires are hot and burny... not good.
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  4. #14
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    Default Re: How Do I Get the Standard Speed From GA-EP45T-UD3LR?

    Quote Originally Posted by grishkafool View Post
    Knowing next to nothing about DDR3 I have a question. If DDR2 800 is really 400x2, how come DDR3 1333 is not 444x3 but is 667 x 2?
    The DDR3 is in fact twice as faster then DDR2 and capable to have the same DDR rate at half memory clock speeds.
    The 8=400x2 is do to the memory being Double Data Rate and not the 2 in DDR2.

  5. #15
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    Default Re: How Do I Get the Standard Speed From GA-EP45T-UD3LR?

    Unfortunately, looking at that RAM I'd say it's definitely not re-usable. At least not at its rated speed, in a next gen Intel platform.

    The future is already here for Intel. It's called Core i7, and the soon to be released Lynnfield (Core i5). Both these CPU's an d all other Intel efforts from now on (I presume) have an integrated RAM controller (MCH). The Core i7 and upcoming i5 really don't like RAM voltage. So much so, there's been a huge rush to get out some sub 1.7V (1.65V is the magic number) high speed kits.

    Those modules run rated speeds at a (relatively) massive 1.9V. This is potentially enough to kill a Core i7. Literally blow it to kingdom come. You may get them running at 1333 with 1.5V at 9-9-9-27 or a shade higher as you increase to no more than 1.65V (on an i7/i5 system), but otherwise they're a one use thing.

    Future proofing never tends to go well. I had all the intentions in the world of upgrading my AMD Socket 939 with a beefier CPU and more RAM ect. However I soon realised in the time I'd used the system it went from cutting edge to extremely low end (2.5 years). As I say thoiugh, if you plan to move to i7/i5 then you can use them, just not at 1.9V. Core i7 will also be at its best with three modules, and you might have trouble getting a single stick.
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  6. #16
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    Default Re: How Do I Get the Standard Speed From GA-EP45T-UD3LR?

    Quote Originally Posted by Psycho101 View Post
    Unfortunately, looking at that RAM I'd say it's definitely not re-usable. At least not at its rated speed, in a next gen Intel platform...

    Future proofing never tends to go well. I had all the intentions in the world of upgrading my AMD Socket 939 with a beefier CPU and more RAM ect. However I soon realised in the time I'd used the system it went from cutting edge to extremely low end (2.5 years). As I say though, if you plan to move to i7/i5 then you can use them, just not at 1.9V. Core i7 will also be at its best with three modules, and you might have trouble getting a single stick.
    Unfortunately, my experience with future-proofing has been the same, but for some reason I haven't been able to give up trying. I don't remember having any other choices than the OCZ for the amount of RAM I wanted when I looked at what was certified for this board, though, and the other RAM I believe was only 1066.

    Thanks for all the info.

  7. #17
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    Default Re: How Do I Get the Standard Speed From GA-EP45T-UD3LR?

    If only you could upgrade the components themselves. Plug more chips on to a RAM stick, or use a socket adaptor to use a newer gen motherboard, similar to the old Pentium overdrive chips designed to fit into old 486 motherboards.

    If you would like to get that RAM running at near rated speed, may I suggest a little FSB overclock with a tweak of the CPU multiplier?

    It is perfectly safe. The QX9770 runs by default on a 400 FSB, so any board compatible with it is guaranteed to run hapily at that speed.

    If you save your current stable settings in a BIOS profile (accessed on the main menu, [F11] and [F12] keys to Load/Save) then set the FSB to 400 and the CPU multiplier to 7.5. This will giove stock speed on the CPU, but using the 4.00 RAM multi will now give you a speed of DDR3-1600, something your modules should do easy with the standard 1.9V, maybe lower.

    If for some reason you can't set a multiplier with a 0.5, then 400*8 would only be 3.2GHz, again, the CPU will 99% positively do that. If setting 8 for the CPU, please take Vcore off auto and set it one or two ticks above the value on the left (default voltage). Also set PLL to standard 1.5V, CPU termination to 1.22V and MCH core to at least 1.22V, maybe more seeing as you have 8GB. With you running virtual machines, having a slightly faster RAM speed and possibly CPU speed would be noticeable, as it's quite system intensive.

    If you do change your mind, and would like to clock further, your CPU will almost definitely do 3.8GHz under the maximum warranted voltage. If using the stock heatsink and fan, I'd stick to around 3.4 though.
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  8. #18
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    Default Re: How Do I Get the Standard Speed From GA-EP45T-UD3LR?

    I couldn't get the machine to post with the FSB set to 400 and the multiplier set to 7.5. That's a great suggestion, and I planned to benchmark it against the optimized defaults and the settings you and others recommended earlier in this thread to see what I got, but no joy.

    Am I correct that I didn't need to do this part:
    If for some reason you can't set a multiplier with a 0.5, then 400*8 would only be 3.2GHz, again, the CPU will 99% positively do that. If setting 8 for the CPU, please take Vcore off auto and set it one or two ticks above the value on the left (default voltage). Also set PLL to standard 1.5V, CPU termination to 1.22V and MCH core to at least 1.22V, maybe more seeing as you have 8GB. With you running virtual machines, having a slightly faster RAM speed and possibly CPU speed would be noticeable, as it's quite system intensive.
    unless I couldn't set a multiplier with 0.5? (Which I could.)

  9. #19
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    Default Re: How Do I Get the Standard Speed From GA-EP45T-UD3LR?

    Even if you can set a multiplier of 7.5, it's certainly a good idea to set those voltages manually. If left on auto, the board sets what it thinks the components need, and more often than not over estimates the voltages.

    A couple of things to try for 400 FSB:

    It's very important to set PCIe frequency manually to 100 when altering the FSB, otherwise it will increase as you raise bus speed. I can't boot at all with anything over 107MHz, and increasing it provides no benefit.

    Set Performance Enhance to Standard. Turbo sets sighter sub-timings and can hinder an overclock. You can re-gain any advantage you had with Turbo/Extreme by manually tweaking sub timings yourself. As these presets alter multiple values at once, you may be stable at a "Turbo like" settings with just a single value higher than the Turbo setting for example.

    In the advanced RAM timings section there is a setting called Static tRead. Set this to 8 to start with for a 400 FSB I can run 7 stable with 411 FSB and I'm sure you could to, but 8 will make sure. Test 7 later. This could be the reason you don't get a POST. If you have a speaker hooked up, and set an incorrect tRead, the board will sound the "beep code" for Power Failure, which is 23 short beeps. Confusing that the manual says Power Error, but it's not. This setting is the number 1 cause of failed posts when first attempting to over clock (in my opinion), and is often overlooked even though it's crucial to set it right

    You may need some additional CPU voltage even though the over all CPU speed is the same. This is due to the FSB increase. You won't need much more. As long as temperatures are good and you check them with CoreTemp or RealTemp (may have to boot to Windoze as I don't know of any Linux utilities that directly poll the core temps) You'll be good. Ignore the CPU temp displayed in the BIOS or in certain utilities, and aim for a core temp (two readings are displayed 1 for each core) of 65c or below, the lower the better.

    Setting CPU termination 1.22V, 1.24V or 1.26V may be required. Also a boost in PLL by one tick could help and certainly won't hurt to do anyway.

    The first three bullet points are crucial, and the others less so, but recommended initially. Feel free to reduce core voltage to as little as possible while maintaining stability Use Intel Burn Test initially as it's a good quick test, and takes about 7-10 minutes to do 5 runs , then a run overnight (to eliminate the inconvenience of having the PC tied up) of Prime95 on "Blend" to confirm the relative stability of the settings. At least 8 hours is recommended.

    If you can fill out the following template, we could give you a likely set of values to use for a 400 FSB standard CPU speed config. It would be very useful to fill in both the values right after the setting name, and the current set value. The value right after is what the BIOS is using at this moment and reveals true values for things that are on [Auto]. The value shown when a setting is [Auto] has been known to be wrong, but at least it'll give a 90% accurate idea of what is set.

    Code:
    Gigabyte GA-EP45-UD3P (Rev. 1.0) - F9
    *************************************
    *************************************
    ******************************
    MB Intelligent Tweaker(M.I.T.) 
    ******************************
    Robust Graphics Booster ..............: [Auto]
    CPU Clock Ratio ......................: [?]
    x Fine CPU Clock Ratio................: +0.0
    CPU Frequency ........................: 
    ********** Clock Chip Control ********
    >>>>>  Standard Clock Control
    CPU Host Clock Control................: [Enabled]
    x CPU Host Frequency(Mhz).............: [?]
    PCI Express Frequency(Mhz)............: [?]
    C.I.A.2...............................: [Disabled]
    >>>>> Advanced Clock Control..........: [Press Enter] 
    CPU Clock Drive.......................: [800mV]
    PCI Express Clock Drive...............: [900mV]
    CPU Clock Skew........................: [  0ps]
    MCH Clock Skew........................: [  0ps]
    ******** DRAM Performance Control ********
    Performance Enhance...................: [Standard]
    Extreme Memory Profile(X.M.P.)........: [Disabled]
    (G)MCH Frequency Latch................: [Auto]
    System Memory Multiplier (SPD)........: [?]
    Memory Frequency(Mhz).............: 
    DRAM Timing Selectable (SPD)..........: [Manual]
    >>>>> Standard Timing Control
    x CAS Latency Time................5...: [ 5]
    x tRCD ...........................5...: [ 4]
    x tRP.............................5...: [ 4]
    x tRAS...........................18...: [12]
    >>>>> Advanced Timing Control.........: [Press Enter] 
    x tRRD............................3...: [ 3]
    x tWTR............................3...: [ 4]
    x tWR.............................6...: [ 6]
    x tRFC...........................52...: [54]
    x tRTP............................3...: [ 3]
    x Command Rate (CMD) .............0...: [ 2]
    >>>>> Channel A Timing Settings.......: [Press Enter] 
    x Static tRead Value.............10...: [ 9]
    
    >>>>> Channel A Driving Settings......: [Press Enter] 
    x Driving Strength Profile............: [1066MHz]
    
    >>>>> Channel B Timing Settings.......: [Press Enter] 
    x Static tRead Value.............10...: [ 9]
    
    >>>>> Channel B Driving Settings......: [Press Enter] 
    x Driving Strength Profile............: [1066MHz]
    
    ****** Motherboard Voltage Control ******
    Voltage Types..........Normal...........Current
    -----------------------------------------------
    >>> CPU
    Load-Line Calibration.................: [Disabled]
    CPU Vcore..............1.27500V.......: [1.39375V]
    CPU Termination........1.200V.........: [1.300V]
    CPU PLL................1.500V.........: [1.570V]
    CPU Reference..........0.760V.........: [Auto]
    >>> MCH/ICH
    MCH Core...............1.100V.........: [1.240V]
    MCH Reference..........0.760V.........: [Auto]
    MCH/DRAM Reference.....0.900V.........: [Auto]
    ICH I/O................1.500V.........: [1.570V]
    ICH Core...............1.100V.........: [1.200V]
    >>> DRAM
    DRAM Voltage...........1.800V.........: [2.080V]
    DRAM Termination.......0.900V.........: [Auto]
    Channel A Reference....0.900V.........: [Auto]
    Channel B Reference....0.900V.........: [Auto]
    Please pay no attention to the settings already in the template. They're not usable for a DDR3 system (at least RAM timings aren't). Remember to fill in both lots of values where apripriate, both the ones on the left (defaults for your particular components) and the current set values. For example:

    "CPU Vcore..............1.27500V.......: [1.39375V]"
    Yours may read: "CPU Vcore..............1.2250V.......: [Auto] ", fill out what ever is shown.

    Sorry for such a long post, but even for a simple reconfiguration without an overclock, it's important that everything is done correctly and safely. I'd hate for you to loose any data due to incorrect settings corrupting files (only happens with way off configs and even then rarely but worth noting).
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  10. #20
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    Default Re: How Do I Get the Standard Speed From GA-EP45T-UD3LR?

    I'm close to whimping out on this one.

    I tried setting the FSB to 400, CPU multiplier to 7.5, PCIe to 100, and static tRead for both channels to 8. The PLL didn't have an option for 1.5V, but was set at 1.55V, so I left it there. With those settings, the system posted but I got a CRC error when Linux attempted to read my encrypted disk. Yikes!

    I restarted and tried setting CPU termination to 1.22V. That time, I got to the same point (attempting to access the hard drive) and got a 1.22 invalid compressed format (err=2) error.

    Another restart and I loaded my "safe" saved profile and I'm back in business with no apparent harm done, but it has me less excited about trying more tweaks. I'm running out of time for today, but if I'm back to feeling more adventurous tomorrow I'll fill out the form with my current values and maybe give it another shot. You may be able to see what I have wrong that's causing the problems.

    I really appreciate all the help.

    As for Linux and core temps, there is a program called lm-sensors in most distros that does capture the core temps. Mine run 35-36C idle. I haven't seen them go up much higher than that so far, and the ambient temp here is about 27C.

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