Please report all spam threads, posts and suspicious members. We receive spam notifications and will take immediate action!
Page 6 of 17 FirstFirst ... 4567816 ... LastLast
Results 51 to 60 of 161

Thread: UD3P and Q9550 Overclock Problems




  1. #51
    kick's Avatar
    kick is offline Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Europe,the wild wild west.
    Posts
    1,223

    Default Re: UD3P and Q9550 Overclock Problems

    No offence Ken but ..those memory /cpu timings are very ordinary rfc 70 etc.
    If your happy great but mainly auto even, on bios should get you better.

    check the posts from conners acebmxer etc n dont worry too much about yours for now.
    Current Systems:

    Asrock p67 Extreme6.............. Gigabyte EP-45 UD3 ...................... Gigabyte 73 PVM S2
    Intel i5 2500k 4.8ghz................ Intel Q8400 3.8ghz......................... Intel D820 2.8ghz
    Zalman 10x cooler.................... Coolermaster V8............................ HP cooler
    8GB Gskill ripjaw ddr3.............. 4GB Gskill PI ddr2.......................... 4GB samsung ddr2
    60GB ssd/500GB HDD .............. WD 1TB hdd.................................... Seagate 160GB hdd
    GTX 460 1GB x2 SLI ................. Msi 9600GT 512MB(died) ........... Onboard gx
    Win7 64 ,750w psu(ocz)............ Win7 64 ,520w psu,seasonic...... Win XP pro ,400w psu

    HEC 6A34 case . ....................... Jeantec R2 case............................ Packard Bell case

    hoping to upgrade to http://www.thinkgeek.com/stuff/41/habicase.shtml
    http://www.flixya.com/video/140325/Animal-launching

  2. #52
    Ken429 is offline Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Valapariso, Indiana
    Posts
    516

    Default Re: UD3P and Q9550 Overclock Problems

    Sorry profJim I forgot to update my templete with the "Normal" to "Auto", etc. These settings are what are in the BIOS and what were used for the "successful" stress test.

    Code:
    Motherboard: Model: GA-EP45-UD3P(rev 1.6) Bios Version: FB
    Cpu: Q9550 E0
    Ram: 2X2GB Brand: Mushkin 996559 XP2-8500 DDR2 - Mushkin Enhanced
    Power Supply Unit: Corsair 620HX
     
    MB Intelligent Tweaker(M.I.T.)
    Robust Graphics Booster ---------------- : [Auto] 
    CPU Clock Ratio ------------------------ : [ 8 X]
    Fine CPU Clock Ratio ------------------- : [+0.5] 
    CPU Frequency -----------------------: 3.80GHz( 450X8)
    Clock Chip Control
    Standard Clock Control
    CPU Host Clock Control ----------------- : [Enabled]
    CPU Host Frequency (Mhz) --------------- : [ 450]
    PCI Express Frequency (Mhz) ------------ : [ 100]
    C.I.A.2 -------------------------------- : [Disabled]
    Advanced Clock Control [Press Enter]
    CPU Clock Drive ------------------------ : [ 800mV]
    PCI Express Clock Drive ---------------- : [ 900Mv]
    CPU Clock Skew (ps) -------------------- : [ 0ps]
    MCH Clock Skew (ps) -------------------- : [ 0ps]
    DRAM Performance Control
    Performance Enhance -------------------- : [Standard]
    Extreme Memory Profile --- (X.M.P.) ---- : [Disabled]
    (G)MCH Frequency Latch ----------------- : [Auto]
    System Memory Multiplier --------------- : [2.40B]
    Memory Frequency (Mhz) -----------------: 1066 1080
    DRAM Timing Selectable -(SPD)----------- : [Manual]
    Standard Timing Control
    CAS Latency Time -------- 5 ------------ : [5]
    tRCD -------------------- 7 ------------ : [ 5]
    tRP --------------------- 7 ------------ : [ 5]
    tRAS ------------------- 24 ------------ : [ 15]
    Advanced Timing Control [Press Enter]
    tRRD -------------------- 4 ------------ : [Auto]
    tWTR -------------------- 4 ------------ : [Auto]
    tWR --------------------- 8 -------------: [Auto]
    tRFC --------------------68 ------------ : [Auto]
    tRTP -------------------- 4 ------------ : [Auto]
    Command Rate (CMD) ------ 0 -------------: [Auto]
    Channel A
    Channel A Timing Settings [Press Enter]
    Static tRead Value ------ 8 ------------ : [Auto]
    tRD Phase0 Adjustment --- 0 ------------ : [Auto]
    tRD Phase1 Adjustment --- 0 ------------ : [Auto]
    tRD Phase2 Adjustment --- 0 ------------ : [Auto]
    tRD Phase3 Adjustment --- 0 ------------ : [Auto]
    Trd2rd(Different Rank) -- 8 ------------ : [Auto]
    Twr2wr(Different Rank) -- 8 ------------ : [Auto]
    Twr2rd(Different Rank) -- 7 ------------ : [Auto]
    Trd2wr(Same/Diff Rank) -- 9 ------------ : [Auto]
    Dimm1 Clock Skew Control --------------- : [Auto]
    Dimm2 Clock Skew Control --------------- : [Auto]
    DDR Write Training --------------------- : [Auto]
    Channel B
    Channel B Timing Settings [Press Enter]
    Static tRead Value ------ 8 ------------ : [Auto]
    tRD Phase0 Adjustment --- 0 ------------ : [Auto]
    tRD Phase1 Adjustment --- 0 ------------ : [Auto]
    tRD Phase2 Adjustment --- 0 ------------ : [Auto]
    tRD Phase3 Adjustment --- 0 ------------ : [Auto]
    Trd2rd(Different Rank) -- 8 ------------ : [Auto]
    Twr2wr(Different Rank) -- 8 ------------ : [Auto]
    Twr2rd(Different Rank) -- 7 ------------ : [Auto]
    Trd2wr(Same/Diff Rank) -- 9 ------------ : [Auto]
    Dimm1 Clock Skew Control --------------- : [Auto]
    Dimm2 Clock Skew Control --------------- : [Auto]
    DDR Write Training --------------------- : [Auto]
    Channel A Driving Settings [Press Enter]
    Driving Strength Profile --------------- : [Auto]
    Data Driving Pull-Up Level ------------- : [Auto]
    Cmd Driving Pull-Up Level ------------- : [Auto]
    Ctrl Driving Pull-Up Level ------------- : [Auto]
    Clk Driving Pull-Up Level ------------- : [Auto]
    Data Driving Pull-Down Level ----------- : [Auto]
    Cmd Driving Pull-Down Level ----------- : [Auto]
    Ctrl Driving Pull-Down Level ----------- : [Auto]
    Clk Driving Pull-Down Level ----------- : [Auto]
    Channel B Driving Settings [Press Enter]
    Driving Strength Profile --------------- : [Auto]
    Data Driving Pull-Up Level ------------- : [Auto]
    Cmd Driving Pull-Up Level ------------- : [Auto]
    Ctrl Driving Pull-Up Level ------------- : [Auto]
    Clk Driving Pull-Up Level ------------- : [Auto]
    Data Driving Pull-Down Level ----------- : [Auto]
    Cmd Driving Pull-Down Level ----------- : [Auto]
    Ctrl Driving Pull-Down Level ----------- : [Auto]
    Clk Driving Pull-Down Level ----------- : [Auto]
    Motherboard Voltage Control
    CPU
    Voltage Types ----------- Normal ---------- Current
    Load-Line Calibration ------------------ : [Disabled]
    CPU Vcore --------------- 1.28750V ----- : [1.31250V] 
    CPU Termination --------- 1.200V* ------ : [1.220V] 
    CPU PLL ----------------- 1.500V* ------ : [1.500V] 
    CPU Reference ----------- 0.760V* ------ : [Auto] 
    MCH/ICH
    MCH Core ---------------- 1.100V ------- : [1.280V] 
    MCH Reference ----------- 0.760V ------- : [Autol]
    MCH/DRAM Ref ------------ 0.900V ------- : [Auto]
    ICH I/O ----------------- 1.500V ------- : [1.570V] 
    ICH Core ---------------- 1.100V ------- : [1.100V] 
    DRAM
    DRAM Voltage ------------ 1.800V ------- : [2.020V] 
    DRAM Termination -------- 0.900V ------- : [Auto]
    Channel A Reference ----- 0.900V ------- : [Auto]
    Channel B Reference ----- 0.900V ------- : [Auto]
    Advanced Settings
    Limit CPUID Max. to 3 ------------------ : [Disabled]
    No-Execute Memory Protect -------------- : [Enabled]
    CPU Enhanced Halt (C1E) ---------------- : [Disabled]
    C2/C2E State Support ------------------- : [Disabled]
    x C4/C4E State Support ----------------- : [Disabled]
    CPU Thermal Monitor 2 (TM2) ------------ : [Enabled]
    CPU EIST Function ---------------------- : [Disabled]
    Virtualization Technology -------------- : [Disabled] 
    Integrated Peripherals
    USB Storage Detect --------------------- : [Disabled]
    Ran Prime95 for 17+ hours with no errors (9/2/2009)
    __________________
    Last edited by Ken429; 09-04-2009 at 10:03 AM.

  3. #53
    Ken429 is offline Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Valapariso, Indiana
    Posts
    516

    Default Re: UD3P and Q9550 Overclock Problems

    Quote Originally Posted by kick View Post
    No offence Ken but ..those memory /cpu timings are very ordinary rfc 70 etc.
    If your happy great but mainly auto even, on bios should get you better.

    check the posts from conners acebmxer etc n dont worry too much about yours for now.
    At this point I am just happy to have a stable system. The MemSet display is a new piece of information for me. I don't know why "Auto" in the BIOS seems to come up with something different than what is shown as the defaults but your right I can force those settings. Is there any way to measure if it really makes the system run any better/faster?

  4. #54
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Earth
    Posts
    849

    Default Re: UD3P and Q9550 Overclock Problems

    I myself find that setting some of the settings manually will bring about more stability. Is this test book overclocking? I sure don't know. Is there even a text book? Nope...all trial and error from what I'm told. The only measurement I hear is real world vs synthetic. Nuther words only you can really judge that in my opine.

    I myself with opinions from the people who know say in general it's best to set settings manually or force as you say. But does auto/normal not force a setting? Does that mean they are the correct setting? I don't know.

    Again I personally feel that manually setting some settings is the better way to go. I submitted settings to you that work really well for my system to try or not. But at the end of the day it's still your call.

    G/L
    Last edited by Conners; 09-04-2009 at 11:39 AM.

  5. #55
    profJim's Avatar
    profJim is online now Chief Munchkin + moderator
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Tacoma, WA. [USA]
    Posts
    7,811

    Default Re: UD3P and Q9550 Overclock Problems

    The displayed bios values don't always reflect the "default" displayed values that are used when [AUTO] is used. This is true for many of the memory timing values.
    With Memset, some of the displayed values don't exactly match the values that you've manually set.

    There are quite a few benchmarking tools that can be used to compare system performance with various bios tweaks.
    You can find them in the Latest Overclocking Programs, System Info, Benchmarking, & Stability Tools thread.

    SuperPI, Everest, Sandra, and CrystalMark of some of the benchmarking programs that you can use.

    Static tRead Value (aka tRD) is called "Performance Level" in Memset. Higher performance is gained when memory settings are set numerically lower. Values that are set too low will result in instability and possible file corruption. This means that each time you tweak bios values, you need to repeat your extended stabiltiy tests.

    Bios Profiles are your best friend.
    When you have a stable setup, you should save your current settings as a saved bios profile. You should also save a hard copy of your bios settings.
    See this post for additional bios profile information.

    With your current setup, the following tweaks should be stable:
    Static tRead Value = 8 <-- for memory channels A & B
    Advanced Timing Control
    tRRD = 3
    tWTR = 3 [Memset will show +7 higher]
    tWR = 5 (4 might be stable) [Memset will show +5 higher]
    tRFC = 52
    tRTP = 3 [Memset will show +2 higher]
    The remaining memory settings should use AUTO.

    My system is stable with 1-3-3-50-1 settings, but it took way too much testing for minimal gains with my setup.
    Using Performance Enhance = Turbo might give some improved performance when tested with a fully stable setup.

    Happy tweaking!
    Q9650 @ 4.10GHz [9x456MHz]
    P35-DS4 [rev: 2.0] ~ Bios: F14
    4x2GB OCZ Reaper PC2-8500 1094MHz @5-5-5-15
    MSI N460GTX Hawk Talon Attack (1GB) video card <---- SLI ---->
    Seasonic SS-660XP2 80 Plus Platinum psu (660w)
    WD Caviar Black WD6401AALS 640GB (data)
    Samsung 840 Pro 256GB SSD (boot)
    SLI @ 16/4 works when running HyperSLI
    Cooler Master 120XL Seidon push/pull AIO cpu water cooling
    Cooler Master HAF XB computer case (RC-902XB-KKN1)
    Asus VH242H 24" monitor [1920x1080]
    MSI N460GTX Hawk (1GB) video card
    Logitech Z-5500 Digital 5.1 Speakers
    win7 x64 sp1 Home Premium
    HT|Omega Claro plus+ sound card
    CyberPower CP1500PFCLCD UPS
    E6300 (R0) @ 3.504GHz [8x438MHz] ~~ P35-DS3L [rev: 1.0] ~ Bios: F9 ~~ 4x2GB Kingston HyperX T1 PC2-8500, 876MHz @4-4-4-10
    Seasonic X650 80+ gold psu (650w) ~~ Xigmatek Balder HDT 1283 cpu cooler ~~ Cooler Master CM 690 case (RC-690-KKN1-GP)
    Samsung 830 128GB SSD MZ-7PC128B/WW (boot) ~~ WD Caviar Black WD6401AALS 640GB (data) ~~ ZM-MFC2 fan controller
    HT|Omega Striker 7.1 sound card ~~ Asus VH242H monitor [1920x1080] ~~ Logitech Z-5500 Digital 5.1 Speakers
    win7 x64 sp1 Home Premium ~~ CyberPower CP1500PFCLCD U.P.S
    .


  6. #56
    Chike is offline Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Israel
    Posts
    6,531

    Default Re: UD3P and Q9550 Overclock Problems

    Quote Originally Posted by Ken429 View Post
    At this point I am just happy to have a stable system. The MemSet display is a new piece of information for me. I don't know why "Auto" in the BIOS seems to come up with something different than what is shown as the defaults but your right I can force those settings. Is there any way to measure if it really makes the system run any better/faster?
    From my observation default values for dvanced timing shown in BIOS are simply the SPD/EPP values not scaled to actual DDR rate.
    Selecting XMP auto or profile1/2 (if you have more than one EPP profile) may or may not change the displaied or apploed values. Most memory's EPP advanced timings are the same as in the SPD, but not always.

    I myself totaly not into memory tweaking, I choose stability with max possible oerformance over minimal or no gain at all for real world usage, with XMP on and all timings, including standard timings, on auto. The only value I set manually is Static tRead Value which is not part of the SPD and the default value in BIOS may be far off what is actually applied.

  7. #57
    profJim's Avatar
    profJim is online now Chief Munchkin + moderator
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Tacoma, WA. [USA]
    Posts
    7,811

    Default Re: UD3P and Q9550 Overclock Problems

    I've seen several posts where enabling XMP memory profiles resulted in badly over-volted memory settings. I believe that XMP profiles in the memory's SPD is only for DDR3 memory.
    If you look at Lsdme's newest Crucial DDR3 memory review, you'll see an example of SPD settings that include separate JDEC and XMP profiles.

    Lsdme has reservations with using the XMP profiles. My preference is to manually enter the memory settings, even if you're copying the pre-programmed values from one of the XMP profiles.

    I've found that tweaking some of the Advanced Timing Control settings is worthwhile and results in a performance increase similar to an FSB increase of 3 - 5 MHz.
    Q9650 @ 4.10GHz [9x456MHz]
    P35-DS4 [rev: 2.0] ~ Bios: F14
    4x2GB OCZ Reaper PC2-8500 1094MHz @5-5-5-15
    MSI N460GTX Hawk Talon Attack (1GB) video card <---- SLI ---->
    Seasonic SS-660XP2 80 Plus Platinum psu (660w)
    WD Caviar Black WD6401AALS 640GB (data)
    Samsung 840 Pro 256GB SSD (boot)
    SLI @ 16/4 works when running HyperSLI
    Cooler Master 120XL Seidon push/pull AIO cpu water cooling
    Cooler Master HAF XB computer case (RC-902XB-KKN1)
    Asus VH242H 24" monitor [1920x1080]
    MSI N460GTX Hawk (1GB) video card
    Logitech Z-5500 Digital 5.1 Speakers
    win7 x64 sp1 Home Premium
    HT|Omega Claro plus+ sound card
    CyberPower CP1500PFCLCD UPS
    E6300 (R0) @ 3.504GHz [8x438MHz] ~~ P35-DS3L [rev: 1.0] ~ Bios: F9 ~~ 4x2GB Kingston HyperX T1 PC2-8500, 876MHz @4-4-4-10
    Seasonic X650 80+ gold psu (650w) ~~ Xigmatek Balder HDT 1283 cpu cooler ~~ Cooler Master CM 690 case (RC-690-KKN1-GP)
    Samsung 830 128GB SSD MZ-7PC128B/WW (boot) ~~ WD Caviar Black WD6401AALS 640GB (data) ~~ ZM-MFC2 fan controller
    HT|Omega Striker 7.1 sound card ~~ Asus VH242H monitor [1920x1080] ~~ Logitech Z-5500 Digital 5.1 Speakers
    win7 x64 sp1 Home Premium ~~ CyberPower CP1500PFCLCD U.P.S
    .


  8. #58
    Chike is offline Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Israel
    Posts
    6,531

    Default Re: UD3P and Q9550 Overclock Problems

    If I leave DRAM Voltage on auto vDIMM is set to 2.14v (in HWMonitor) but result is the same if I set 2.1v manually in BIOS, so it may not be just XMP fault. Even with XMP disabled the motherboard over volt the standard 1.8v to 1.9v when on auto.
    I never mentioned voltage, I was talking about timings.

    The values in the SPD are good for a specific DDR rate only, auto will scale them up or down as nesessary, with the exceprion of CAS which may not always scale, depending on actual memory speed, with or without XMP.
    The EPP is just another profile that does not comply to the JEDEC standard.
    Setting XMP simply tells the BIOS to use the EPP instead the JEDEC stdandard profile, nothing more.

    As I said, I prefer stability or safety, over minor gain in memory benchmark.

    Opinions vary, I am just presenting mine.
    Last edited by Chike; 09-04-2009 at 05:24 PM.

  9. #59
    Ken429 is offline Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Valapariso, Indiana
    Posts
    516

    Default Re: UD3P and Q9550 Overclock Problems

    profJim -

    You are on a role. The memory timings have not affected the stability of the system - at least not for the first 8 hours of stress testing. The quick and dirty NovaBench 2 benchmark program says the system ran a little faster and 3DMarkVantage liked the changes also.

    Now, if I want to stay at 3.8GHz for the next few years should I try to reduce the MCH Core voltage a tad? What about the ICH I/O @ 1.57V? And since I bumped the Vcore two jumps from 1.30V to 1.31250V when I increased the CPU Termination from 1.20V to 1.22V should I try lowering the Vcore slightly - I really don't know which one got me to stability? Lastly, is there any reason to keep the CPU from automatically lowering the CPU clock when the system is idle since the overclocking has not increased the Vcore significantly?

    Next if greed sets in and I want to get to 3.925GHz, what settings do your recommend I need to increase other than possibly the Vcore?

  10. #60
    profJim's Avatar
    profJim is online now Chief Munchkin + moderator
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Tacoma, WA. [USA]
    Posts
    7,811

    Default Re: UD3P and Q9550 Overclock Problems

    LOL, it's not "greed", you've caught the o/c bug.

    Glad to see that you're making progress.
    Right now you're running a 34% overclock, with Cpu Vcore close to the stock VID for your cpu. At this point you should save your stable settings as a saved bios profile. You can save up to 8 different bios profiles and you can replace any of the profiles with a different saved profile.

    If you want, you can try lowering Cpu Vcore, but this means that each bios change requires repeating your extended stability tests. It's best to change only one bios setting at a time and then perform your tests. If you change two or more settings and the stability test fails, you won't know which of the changes caused the failure.

    Cpu Termination (aka VTT) increases can help with system stability.
    The general recommendation is that VTT should be at least 0.05 - 0.10 volts lower than Cpu Vcore.
    Your ICH I/O and Core voltages are fine and shouldn't need further increases.

    Performance Enhance = Standard is recommended while overclocking. Once your system is stable, set this to Turbo and repeat your stability tests and benchmarks. I like running CrystalMark benchmarks, as this gives performance scores for several categories, including cpu, memory, hdd, and video categories. There are many other excellent benchmark utilities.

    Additional memory performance enhancements will be modest if you want to tweak the Advanced Timing Control settings.
    Using 3-3-5-52-3 (tRRD-tWTR-tWR-tRFC-tRTP)with your Mushkin memory should be stable.
    My system is stable with 1-3-3-50-1 settings, but this took a huge amount of testing for minimal gains.
    Food for thought, my system was stable with:
    FSB = 459
    Memory = 459 x 2.40B = 1102MHz (5-5-5-15 @ 2.02 volts) 2.06 - 2.12 volts might be required
    tRD = 8
    MCH Core = 1.28 works for me. 1.26 was stable, but my system didn't feel as smooth using 1.26 volts.
    With your Q9550, you might be able to use a bit higher FSB with these settings.

    EIST + C1E + C2/C2E + C4/C4E should be left disabled while overclocking and stability testing. You can enable these settings and see if they result in lower temperatures and cpu frequencies when your system is idle or under low cpu loading. As usual, you'll need to repeat stability testing.

    Overclocking your system to 3.9 - 4.0GHz should be fairly easy with some minor voltage tweaks. Performance gains will be small. Going any higher will require a lot of additional work. Check out some of the Q9550 threads in the forum and you'll see what's involved. Some of the most informative threads involved Conners and Prospector. Use the forum's advanced search feature and enter their names in the "search threads started by" option.

    It's best to run extended Prime95 or OCCT stability tests using:
    1) small FFTs
    2) blend
    3) large FFTs
    Some only run all 3 tests after they've settled on a final overclock.
    Last edited by profJim; 09-08-2009 at 05:55 PM. Reason: typo correction
    Q9650 @ 4.10GHz [9x456MHz]
    P35-DS4 [rev: 2.0] ~ Bios: F14
    4x2GB OCZ Reaper PC2-8500 1094MHz @5-5-5-15
    MSI N460GTX Hawk Talon Attack (1GB) video card <---- SLI ---->
    Seasonic SS-660XP2 80 Plus Platinum psu (660w)
    WD Caviar Black WD6401AALS 640GB (data)
    Samsung 840 Pro 256GB SSD (boot)
    SLI @ 16/4 works when running HyperSLI
    Cooler Master 120XL Seidon push/pull AIO cpu water cooling
    Cooler Master HAF XB computer case (RC-902XB-KKN1)
    Asus VH242H 24" monitor [1920x1080]
    MSI N460GTX Hawk (1GB) video card
    Logitech Z-5500 Digital 5.1 Speakers
    win7 x64 sp1 Home Premium
    HT|Omega Claro plus+ sound card
    CyberPower CP1500PFCLCD UPS
    E6300 (R0) @ 3.504GHz [8x438MHz] ~~ P35-DS3L [rev: 1.0] ~ Bios: F9 ~~ 4x2GB Kingston HyperX T1 PC2-8500, 876MHz @4-4-4-10
    Seasonic X650 80+ gold psu (650w) ~~ Xigmatek Balder HDT 1283 cpu cooler ~~ Cooler Master CM 690 case (RC-690-KKN1-GP)
    Samsung 830 128GB SSD MZ-7PC128B/WW (boot) ~~ WD Caviar Black WD6401AALS 640GB (data) ~~ ZM-MFC2 fan controller
    HT|Omega Striker 7.1 sound card ~~ Asus VH242H monitor [1920x1080] ~~ Logitech Z-5500 Digital 5.1 Speakers
    win7 x64 sp1 Home Premium ~~ CyberPower CP1500PFCLCD U.P.S
    .


Page 6 of 17 FirstFirst ... 4567816 ... LastLast

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •