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Thread: GA-EP45-DS3 E8400 Overclock cold boot issues, faulty ram channel?




  1. #1
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    Question GA-EP45-DS3 E8400 Overclock cold boot issues, faulty ram channel?

    Hi,

    I was hoping someone could help. I have had all sorts of problems configuring and getting this board working but I have perserverred and have a pretty stable system.


    So the other day I bought a new heat sink with the idea of overclocking my E8400. Here is the system.


    Mother Board: GA-EP4-DS3

    Bios: F10d
    CPU: Core 2 Duo E8400 (E0)
    PSU: Zalman ZM600-ST
    Memory: Corsair CM2X2048-8500C5C (4GB Ram)
    Cooler: Aywun A1-V10

    So I started overclocking the PC an have read various posts on this forum and ultimately was able to achieve a stable 4.0Ghz overclock.

    (With the A1-V10 I am able to run Prime 95 with the fan on its lowest setting I am getting temperatures equiavalent to the stock cooler on stock 3.0Ghz, 51 Degrees max on Core 0, 47 Core 1 :-) )

    The issue is that when overclocked it will not cold boot. If I leave the machine off for 2-3 hours when I try to start it will have issues booting.

    To describe the problem think of the normal boot process, it will:
    1. Show you your CPU and memory
    2. Detect IDE drives
    3. Flick up some IRQ messages
    4. Verifying DMI pool
    5. Boot windows.

    In my case on a cold boot it will seem to hang between point 2 & 3, or just run very slowly. If you leave it long enough it will eventually attempt to load windows but it

    generally fails. If I try to enter the bios during one of these starts it will take 1-2 minutes to enter the bios.

    What I find myself doing is, I wait for the hang between point 2 & 3, press Ctrl + Alt + Del and then it will reboot and run without problems. Also after this I can restart the computer as many times as I want with no issues, its only after being powered off for 2-3 hours that I get the cold boot issue.


    So, I started all the usual diagnostic things and I have a second issue.

    I have tested my Ram with MemTest 4.15b with the following results:

    - Channel 1 - (Yellow, DDR2_1 & DDR2_3) @ 1066Mhz - FAILED - DDR2_1 throws hundreds of errors every second, and in DDR2_3 still throw errors but only 4/5 every 4/5 sec
    - Channel 2 - (Red, DDR2_2 & DDR2_4) @ 1066Mhz - PASS - No Errors
    - Channel 1 @ 800Mhz - Passed

    So I can't get the memory to run @ 1066Mhz in channel 1.


    So, It may be my board is faulty, and I should have it replaced? If so read no further. But if I can't get it replaced then I would like to try and get the cold boot issue fixed.


    I realise that a 4.0Ghz overclock might be a bit aggressive so I have been trying to get 3.6Ghz working as a starting point.


    I am wondering if you can give me any tips on what I might be able to do to get it to cold boot.


    Note when I set the voltage to 1.30 it generally shows up as 1.264 in CPU-Z and drops to 1.248 when running prime 95, probably normal, but may also be a sign of my Zalman PSU not being upt to the task?


    Here is my current bios when @ 3.6Ghz


    Code:
    
    MB Intelligent Tweaker(M.I.T.)
    Robust Graphics Booster ..................: Auto
    CPU Clock Ratio ..........................: 9.0
    Fine CPU Clock Ratio......................:.0
    CPU Frequency ............................: 3.60Ghz
    
    
    Clock Chip Control   
    Standard Clock Control
    CPU Host Clock Control....................: [Enabled] 
    CPU Host Frequency (Mhz) .................: 400 Mhz
    PCI Express Frequency (Mhz) ..............: 100
    
    C.I.A.2 ..................................:[Disabled] 
    
    
    Advanced Clock Control [Press Enter]  
    CPU Clock Drive...........................: <<< 800
    PCI Express Clock Drive...................: <<< 900
    CPU Clock Skew (ps).......................: <<< 
    MCH Clock Skew (ps).......................: <<< 
    
    
    DRAM Performance Control  
    Performance Enhance.......................: [STANDARD]
    Extreme Memory Profile (X.M.P.)...........: Disabled
    (G)MCH Frequency Latch....................: [Auto]
    System Memory Multiplier .................: 2.66D
    Memory Frequency (Mhz) ...................: 1066Mhz
    DRAM Timing Selectable ...................: [Manual]
    
    Standard Timing Control 
    CAS Latency Time..........................: 5
    tRCD .....................................: 6
    tRP'......................................: 6
    tRAS......................................: 16
    
    Set all Suggested below to highest Values first.  Then later you can lower, one at a time, testing as you go 
    
    Advanced Timing Control 
    tRRD......................................: 4 [Auto]
    tWTR......................................: 4 [Auto]
    tWR.......................................: 6
    tRFC......................................: 62
    tRTP......................................: 4 [Auto]
    Command Rate (CMD) .......................: 2
    
    Driving Strength Profiles 
    Driving Strength .........................: 1066
    
    Channel A 
    Static tRead Value........................: 10 [Auto]
     tRD Phase0 Adjustment....................: 0  [Auto] <<< Leave for all below as well
    tRD Phase1 Adjustment.....................: 0  [Auto]
     tRD Phase2 Adjustment ...................: 0  [Auto]
     tRD Phase3 Adjustment....................: 0  [Auto]
    Trd2rd(Different Rank)....................: 8  [Auto]
    Twr2wr(Different Rank)....................: 8  [Auto] 
    Twr2rd(Different Rank)....................: 7  [Auto]
    Trd2wr(Same/Diff Rank)....................: 9  [Auto] 
    Dimm1 Clock Skew Control..................:Auto  ps
    Dimm2 Clock Skew Control..................:Auto  ps
    
    Channel B 
    Static tRead Value........................: 10 [Auto]
     tRD Phase0 Adjustment....................: 0  [Auto] <<< Leave for all below as well
    tRD Phase1 Adjustment.....................: 0  [Auto]
     tRD Phase2 Adjustment ...................: 0  [Auto]
     tRD Phase3 Adjustment....................: 0  [Auto]
    Trd2rd(Different Rank)....................: 8  [Auto]
    Twr2wr(Different Rank)....................: 8  [Auto] 
    Twr2rd(Different Rank)....................: 7  [Auto]
    Trd2wr(Same/Diff Rank)....................: 9  [Auto] 
    Dimm1 Clock Skew Control..................:Auto  ps
    Dimm2 Clock Skew Control..................:Auto  ps
    
    Motherboard Voltage Control 
    
    CPU 
    CPU Vcore….………............................: 1.30
    CPU Termination…..... 1.200V*.............: 1.2 [Auto] - read post where DS3 would  not post with this set
    CPU PLL…………………....1.500V*.................: 1.5 [Auto] 
    CPU Referene…………....0.755V*...............: 0.76 [Auto]
    
    MCH/ICH 
    MCH Core…………….....1.100V..................: 1.20
    MCH Reference….…….0.760V..................: <<< Leave
    MCH/DRAM Ref.…......0.900V................: <<< Leave
    ICH I/O……………….....1.500V..................: <<< Leave
    ICH Core…………...……1.100V...................: <<< Leave
    
    DRAM 
    DRAM Voltage ……....1.800V.................: 2.1 
    DRAM Termination .…0.900V.................: <<< Leave
    Channel A Reference 0.900V................: <<< Leave
    Channel B Reference 0.900V................: <<< Leave
    
    Advanced Settings 
    Limit CPUID Max. to 3.....................: [Disabled]
    No-Execute Memory Protect.................: [Enabled]
    CPU Enhanced Halt (C1E)...................: [Disabled]
    C2/C2E State Support......................: [Disabled]
    x C4/C4E State Support....................: [Disabled]
    CPU Thermal Monitor 2(TM2) ...............: [Enabled]
    CPU EIST Function.........................: [Disabled]
    Virtualization Technology.................: [Enabled]
    
    Integrated Peripherals 
    Legacy USB Storage Detect ................: [Disabled]  
    
    
    Thanks for your help :-)

  2. #2
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    Default Re: GA-EP45-DS3 E8400 Overclock cold boot issues, faulty ram channel?

    I have been unable to run 1066 myself with more than 2.08 V, it starts to rain errors.

    You should set MCH, PLL, adn Termination to 'Normal' from drop down. Dram to maximum possible, but <2.08V maintainable without errors. Too much voltage kills, the good connection between MCH and dram, MCH being 65nm, cant handle more than 2.08V.

    CPU Termination…..... 1.200V*.............: Normal
    CPU PLL…………………....1.500V*.................: Normal
    MCH Core…………….....1.100V..................: Normal
    DRAM Voltage ……....1.800V.................: 2.06

    I can run 500 FSB ith the exact same settings and 1:1 2.00D and 1.82V dram., just because one Stick requires 1.82, the others can work with 1.8.

    Now that you mention the Dram Channels, the only thing that is being affected is this.



    Static tRead Value........................: 10 [Auto] = 9

    These values depend on the channels, the ones being closer to the cpu get more aggresive fine delay, and that is bad, and also depend on whether you set too much voltage, Termination, Dram, PLL, therefore that is why you should set the forced mode "Normal" wich keeps the defaults on the left.

    these should be always the same numbers each time you boot. 9 neutral 10 0 10 0. If they deviate this is a sign to slighlty touch some of the voltages until it is stable, MCH 1.16 or 1.18... etc.
    Last edited by yuu; 06-07-2010 at 08:21 PM.

  3. #3
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    Default Re: GA-EP45-DS3 E8400 Overclock cold boot issues, faulty ram channel?

    Yuu

    Will try the voltage on the RAM. The corsair spec however suggests 2.1 volts, but I will play around and see if I can run the RAM in channel 1 with the lower voltage.

    I am pretty sure that I will get the same errors, as I have vague memories of having the same issues when I first setup the board, and I was running the stock 1.8 Volts,

    I don't think the voltage can explain why they would fail in channel 1, but test perfectly in channel 2 running @ 1066Mhz with no bios changes between tests?

    Note: Testing this will be slow as I can only check to see if it has made any difference generally in the mornings and evening doing a cold boot.

    Thanks for the feedback

  4. #4
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    Default Re: GA-EP45-DS3 E8400 Overclock cold boot issues, faulty ram channel?

    You should set MCH, PLL, and Termination to 'Normal' from drop down.
    "Normal" is not a voltage option with the EP45, AUTO is the default setting.
    AUTO should NOT be used with some voltage settings when overclocking, CPU Termination (VTT) and CPU PLL will often be seriously overvolted when overclocking. You can confirm this with an ET6 screen-shot using the Tuner/Advance/Voltage window.

    Your reported CPU Vcore idle and load results are normal, as this is a typical amount of vdroop with EP45 systems.
    With 2x2GB of memory running at 1066MHz, MCH Core usually needs to be 1.22 - 1.26 volts when overclocking.

    I'm not sure which memory you have, from the Corsair XMS2 website:
    TWIN2X4096-8500C5 ---- PC2-8500 --- 4GB Kit 5-5-5-15
    TWIN2X4096-8500C5C --- PC2-8500 --- 4GB Kit 5-6-6-15
    CM2X2048-6400C5 ------- PC2-6400 --- 2GB -- 5-5-5-18

    The TWIN2X4096-8500C5DF spec sheet shows:
    4096 Megabytes of DDR2 memory
    - Two matched CM2X2048-8500C5D modules
    - Includes Airflow Fan for maximum thermal transfer
    - JEDEC standard 5-5-5-18 values at 800MHz
    - EPP .. standard 5-5-5-15-2T, 2.1V values

    Try the following settings:
    CPU Host Frequency (Mhz) -------------: 401 or 402 Mhz
    System Memory Multiplier --------------: 2.66D <-- you might want to test using 2.00D, 2.00B, or 2.40B
    CPU Termination ------- 1.200V* ------: 1.2 <-- try 1.22 or 1.24, possibly 1.10 (if available)
    CPU PLL --------------- 1.500V* ------: AUTO <-- try 1.50 or 1.57
    MCH Core ------------- 1.100V --------: 1.20 < -- try 1.22 - 1.26, possibly 1.05
    DRAM Voltage --------- 1.800V --------: 2.10 <-- try 2.06 - 2.12

    Follow steps 1, 2 and 4 in this post to provide additional information.
    Last edited by profJim; 06-10-2010 at 04:02 AM. Reason: spelling
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    Default Re: GA-EP45-DS3 E8400 Overclock cold boot issues, faulty ram channel?

    Excuse me, i know my motherboard, and the only thing that gets overvolted if left on auto is the CPU, PLL, Termination, MCH, and Dram. I still recommend using the "Normal" option as the only viable option to keep the dafault Termination in play, because if it gets deviated from this you are bound to have problems. The EP45-DS3 is based on A2 crystal, so the rules for the UD3 series don't exactly apply. as i said you dont touch the mch, the pll, and the vtt up to 500 FSB, the >500FSB you can adjust the MCH a little and if you run 1066 DRAM maybe too, but 1.26 is outrageus. I run upto 440FSB with 1.05V on MCH.






    Actually i think 2.66D is broken. voltage or no voltage on MCH.

  6. #6
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    Default Re: GA-EP45-DS3 E8400 Overclock cold boot issues, faulty ram channel?

    The EP45-DS3(r) manual (rev 1004) shows that AUTO is the default setting and doesn't mention the NORMAL option.
    The UD3 series doesn't have a NORMAL option for bios voltage settings.
    I believe that using the NORMAL option doesn't allow the setting to auto-adjust upwards when you overclock.
    The MCH Core recommendation of 1.20+ settings applies to most 4GB 8500MHz memory setups with the UD3 series.
    GSkill 4GB 8500 memory often needs MCH Core = 1.05 volts or lower for stability.
    I don't recall seeing sub 1.20 volt settings with 4GB of Corsair 8500 memory.

    MCH Core settings that are too low or too high often cause boot problems and/or instability.
    It looks like you are running 3x2GB of A-DATA 800MHz memory.
    I've seen several threads where the 2.66D memory multiplier has caused problems with FSB = 400+ MHz.

    Thanks for the NORMAL bios setting option information for the DS3 series.
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    Default Re: GA-EP45-DS3 E8400 Overclock cold boot issues, faulty ram channel?

    Quote Originally Posted by profJim View Post
    The EP45-DS3(r) manual (rev 1004) shows that AUTO is the default setting and doesn't mention the NORMAL option.
    The UD3 series doesn't have a NORMAL option for bios voltage settings.
    I believe that using the NORMAL option doesn't allow the setting to auto-adjust upwards when you overclock.
    The MCH Core recommendation of 1.20+ settings applies to most 4GB 8500MHz memory setups with the UD3 series.
    GSkill 4GB 8500 memory often needs MCH Core = 1.05 volts or lower for stability.
    I don't recall seeing sub 1.20 volt settings with 4GB of Corsair 8500 memory.

    MCH Core settings that are too low or too high often cause boot problems and/or instability.
    It looks like you are running 3x2GB of A-DATA 800MHz memory.
    I've seen several threads where the 2.66D memory multiplier has caused problems with FSB = 400+ MHz.

    Thanks for the NORMAL bios setting option information for the DS3 series.
    I don't know about other UD3 series boards but my rev 1.0 UD3 has Normal option for all voltages.
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  8. #8
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    Default Re: GA-EP45-DS3 E8400 Overclock cold boot issues, faulty ram channel?

    I'm gonna quit while I'm behind, before I have to eat any more of my words about the NORMAL bios voltage option with EP45 motherboards.

    Thanks for the corrections.
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    SLI @ 16/4 works when running HyperSLI
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  9. #9
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    Default Re: GA-EP45-DS3 E8400 Overclock cold boot issues, faulty ram channel?

    So you guys getting this issue sorted out or not?

    OP, you should be able to set/adjust Vtt for sure, can you at stock settings? If you are not sure please test.

    That is a key voltage, and for 4Ghz I would be suggesting 1.26-1.34 normally, so I really think you should sort this out. You may need to adjust MCH ref in order to properly set this, I think a stock test will let us know, if you can adjust it at stock clocks then it is likely you need to adjust MCH ref before you will get anywhere with Vtt adjustments

    As for your channel 1 fail, yes you can RMA the board based on this as the proper configuration for a dual channel setup is 1+3 channel 1 anyway. RMA takes 2 weeks or so normally, not sure how long though it is in AU.

    RMA is valid for 3 years from date of manufacturer so you should still be able to RMA if you wanted to.

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    Default Re: GA-EP45-DS3 E8400 Overclock cold boot issues, faulty ram channel?

    Ok,

    Bit of a progress update.

    With the memory still in channel 2, because that is where it is currently stable I dropped the memory timings down to 2.00D for 800Mhz.

    This enabled me to do a cold boot without issues @ 3.6Ghz overclock. So my cold boot issues are obviously related to trying to push my memory to 1066mhz.

    As for the corsair memory, It is hard to find info on it but here is what CPU-Z says

    Attachment 2611

    hence why I am running it at 5-6-6-16 @ 1066, (I didn't just make it up ;-) )

    A few questions?

    • Should I be scared of running the memory @ 2.1volts? Getting different opinions.
    • For the advanced memory timings what should the Static tRead value be.

    That is a key voltage, and for 4Ghz I would be suggesting 1.26-1.34 normally, so I really think you should sort this out. You may need to adjust MCH ref in order to properly set this, I think a stock test will let us know, if you can adjust it at stock clocks then it is likely you need to adjust MCH ref before you will get anywhere with Vtt adjustments
    I assume 1.26-1.34 is in relation to CPU Termination? How is this effected by MCH Reference? What would I need to adjust it too, most posts say leave.

    I will continue tweaking the MCH voltages as per suggestions and see what gets it stable.

    Cheers

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