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Thread: How to Ensure SATA III TRIM on X58A-UD3R, Intel 510 6GB/s SSD, Marvell 9128?




  1. #11
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    Default Re: How to Ensure SATA III TRIM on X58A-UD3R, Intel 510 6GB/s SSD, Marvell 9128?

    Quote Originally Posted by ABalthazor View Post
    I think I found out why the 510 may be able to be manipulated when connected to your Marvell ports; it appears if you use the default MS AHCI driver, instead of installing the Marvell, then the Intel Toolbox will still function with the drive. The Marvell driver prevents this from happening. Of course the question remains whether or not you actually need the Toolbox at all, and the related OP's question about TRIM is related to that.
    Thank you for your response. I have noticed that the AS SSD benchmark tool shows the driver in the upper left corner, msahci. I discovered that installing the Marvell console driver prevents the Intel SSD Toolbox from operating, and the AS SSD benchmark tool shows something like "mv91xx" as the driver (the Marvell driver seems to result in a marginal improvement in 4K read/write speeds on the Intel 510 SSD, but same sequential speeds).

    I have uninstalled the Marvell console driver from Windows 7 "Add/remove programs", which reinstates the msahci driver and allows the Intel SSD Toolbox to operate again -- which in turn provides a means to run TRIM manually (the "Intel SSD Optimizer"). This to me is vital, given the apparent inability of the Marvell 9128 to pass TRIM commands to a 6GB/s SSD (curious situation: no one seems to know or be prepared to say, including Crucial and Gigabyte).

    FYI, a new round of Gigabyte X58A BIOS made their appearance as final in the last couple days. I have not seen any forum postings indicating or suggesting that the new BIOS have any effect on the TRIM (or non-TRIM) issue.

  2. #12
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    Default Re: How to Ensure SATA III TRIM on X58A-UD3R, Intel 510 6GB/s SSD, Marvell 9128?

    Quote Originally Posted by ABalthazor View Post
    Device manager will tell you which driver you are using, it isn't a tossup. And it is likely a Microsoft default driver, since Intel's drivers won't interact with the Marvell controller.

    Other than doing your own testing on a known TRIM-enabled set of ports like the Intel SATA 6G ones on the P67 chipset and comparing them to the Marvell SATA 6G speeds, or finding such tests on the net, I'm not sure how you'd find this out.

    I asked about your 510 on the marvell ports and the SSD toolbox because the SSD toolbox will not perform any functions on my 510 when connected to the Marvell 9182 chip on my board (a more recent version of the one on your board.) It sees the drive, but won't do anything with it, unless I connect it to my ICH10 SATA ports.
    Short answer on how one would find out: Someone at Gigabyte, or with close access to Gigabyte, would go on record as saying, one way or the other, that the Marvell 9128 controller does or does not pass TRIM commands to a SATA III SSD (and, if the answer is yes, would provide a concise set of "Do A, then do B, then do C" steps to follow). That no one in a position of knowledge or access to knowledge -- not manufacturer, not forum -- is able or prepared to say anything, is probably the most telling fact. My conclusion is that the Marvell 9128 controller in fact and actuality does *not* pass TRIM commands to a 6GB/s SSD, regardless of driver used, and that one who owns an Intel 6GB/s SSD is advised to preserve, and not jeopardize, his ability to run TRIM manually using the Intel SSD Toolkit.

  3. #13
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    Default Re: How to Ensure SATA III TRIM on X58A-UD3R, Intel 510 6GB/s SSD, Marvell 9128?

    It would certainly be nice to know one way or another. I'm sure somewhere someone has done some tests by putting a bunch of data on the drives, deleting it using the different controllers / drivers, and checking performance to establish whether or not trim is working. I suppose I could do that when I have some time.

    I wonder if running the SSD optimizer using the MS AHCI driver on the Marvell controller actually does anything? I mean, if the TRIM commands aren't being passed by the controller, then you may just be able to run the tool without accomplishing anything. Sounds like this aspect needs testing also. Just because the driver and toolbox 'think' they are sending TRIM commands doesn't mean the drive is receiving those commands.
    Raven RV03 / Gigabyte G1.Sniper / 990x / 12GB RAM / 3 x 580 GTX / 2 x 250GB 510 & 3 x 160GB X-25M Intel SSDs / Antec HCP 1200W

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    Default Re: How to Ensure SATA III TRIM on X58A-UD3R, Intel 510 6GB/s SSD, Marvell 9128?

    Quote Originally Posted by ABalthazor View Post
    It would certainly be nice to know one way or another. I'm sure somewhere someone has done some tests by putting a bunch of data on the drives, deleting it using the different controllers / drivers, and checking performance to establish whether or not trim is working. I suppose I could do that when I have some time.

    I wonder if running the SSD optimizer using the MS AHCI driver on the Marvell controller actually does anything? I mean, if the TRIM commands aren't being passed by the controller, then you may just be able to run the tool without accomplishing anything. Sounds like this aspect needs testing also. Just because the driver and toolbox 'think' they are sending TRIM commands doesn't mean the drive is receiving those commands.
    On running the Intel SSD Optimizer in the Intel SSD Toolkit 2.0.2: Your point is well taken, disconcerting as it may be. To even get the Toolkit running again, after uninstalling the Marvell console driver, I had to uninstall and reinstall the Toolkit. If the Toolkit's TRIM commands cannot reach the SSD, even with the latest BIOS that updates the 9128 firmware and even with the SATA III Firmware in BIOS set to "Bypass", then that suggests moving the SSD to a SATA II port and forgoing SATA III sequential speeds (the strong point of the Intel 510, which lags behind, e.g., the Intel G2 160GB drives in terms of 4K performance).

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    Default Re: How to Ensure SATA III TRIM on X58A-UD3R, Intel 510 6GB/s SSD, Marvell 9128?

    Shouldn't there already be an easy 'test to see if trim is working' tool? Something that will write a file, record the sectors/cells or whatever where the data is located, issue a delete command for the file, and check to see if the cells have been cleared or not?

    Some users have suggested that the drives may have some sort of garbage collection that will periodically clean up unused cells, but I haven't seen if this is specifically done with the 510 series.
    Raven RV03 / Gigabyte G1.Sniper / 990x / 12GB RAM / 3 x 580 GTX / 2 x 250GB 510 & 3 x 160GB X-25M Intel SSDs / Antec HCP 1200W

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    Default Re: How to Ensure SATA III TRIM on X58A-UD3R, Intel 510 6GB/s SSD, Marvell 9128?

    Man, I just ran AS SSD on my 510 (attached via Marvell 9182, using Marvell driver) and then on my X-25M G2 drive (attached to ICH10, using Intel driver), and the 510 sure is disappointing. Sequential speeds is all it has going for it.

    I guess I'll hold on to these SSDs until my next upgrade, probably when the LGA 2011 comes out.
    Raven RV03 / Gigabyte G1.Sniper / 990x / 12GB RAM / 3 x 580 GTX / 2 x 250GB 510 & 3 x 160GB X-25M Intel SSDs / Antec HCP 1200W

  7. #17
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    Default Re: How to Ensure SATA III TRIM on X58A-UD3R, Intel 510 6GB/s SSD, Marvell 9128?

    Two things, I'd advise you not use Marvell drivers on the 9128 controller, although the newer drivers are better performance-wise, they still remain less stable than using MSAHCI.

    There is no TRIM passed through on the Marvell controller, with any driver, or any BIOS mode settings.

    The Intel SATA 3Gb/s controller would be better for any 6Gb/s drive, simply because it is way better at random performance, the only thing the 6Gb/s port is better at is Sequential speeds which really don't have much of any effect on performance.

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    Default Re: How to Ensure SATA III TRIM on X58A-UD3R, Intel 510 6GB/s SSD, Marvell 9128?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lsdmeasap View Post
    Two things, I'd advise you not use Marvell drivers on the 9128 controller, although the newer drivers are better performance-wise, they still remain less stable than using MSAHCI.

    There is no TRIM passed through on the Marvell controller, with any driver, or any BIOS mode settings.

    The Intel SATA 3Gb/s controller would be better for any 6Gb/s drive, simply because it is way better at random performance, the only thing the 6Gb/s port is better at is Sequential speeds which really don't have much of any effect on performance.
    Thank you for taking the time and trouble to reply and anwer this question, definitively. I appreciate your pointing out the right thing to do to keep a costly SSD running in good condition. I have followed your advice and moved the SSD to SATA II port 0 on the Intel RST 10.1.0.1015 isStor driver, 4K read/write has improved to 20/45, sequential write remains at 200, and sequential read is 265 -- all quite fine. I'm sure others, too, will appreciate having a conclusive answer to this issue. With thanks and best regards.

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    Default Re: How to Ensure SATA III TRIM on X58A-UD3R, Intel 510 6GB/s SSD, Marvell 9128?

    No problem, I'm always happy to help!

    I often test the latest Marvell drivers each time they come out for TRIM capability for users over at the Crucial forums, so I am constantly checking, and I have yet to see TRIM take place in any form on a 9128 device (Same applies to 9123 but I don't have one)

    Intel 3Gb/s ports are much better anyway, check out my C300 review linked in my signature for a comparison of a few controllers.

  10. #20
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    Default Re: How to Ensure SATA III TRIM on X58A-UD3R, Intel 510 6GB/s SSD, Marvell 9128?

    I did some testing with my 510 SSDs, and they get substantially improved performance accross the board using the Marvel 9182 (w/ Marvell) vs. ICH10 (using RST.)

    Besides the expected sequential improvements, the random 4k reads and access times were improved by 50% on the Marvel 9182.

    The 9128 may have different results, as may other SSDs, but for now I'm leaving the 510s on the 9182s on my board.

    That's not to say that random performance on the 510s was great, it wasn't, on par or just shy of the random 4k performance of my X-25M drives. And X-25M access times were about 2/3 the speed of the 510s.
    Raven RV03 / Gigabyte G1.Sniper / 990x / 12GB RAM / 3 x 580 GTX / 2 x 250GB 510 & 3 x 160GB X-25M Intel SSDs / Antec HCP 1200W

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