Is there really THAT much difference between a Ti 4200 8x an

[webe3]

Title says it all! I can get the 4x Ti 4200's on ebay for a steal, but the Ti4200 8x AGP is a little more. Is it worth the extra money for the speed? (if I get a motherboard that supports 8x....like the Asus A7N8X Deluxe?) Just wondering......because I saw some 3d benchmark test results where the Ti 4200 8x was supposedly faster than the new fx 5600! Is this true?

[Wiggo]

This is one of those yes and no answers for both but 8x AGP doesn't add a great deal of real world performance though the Ti4200 will usually leave the FX5600 behind in all DX7/8 games and benchies.

[E^vol]

The trade off is, with the FX5600, you get Direct X 9.0 support.
ie: Future games.....

[Wiggo]

I'm still waitin' for more of these DX8 ones to become available atm that were spose to be here by now. Maybe next year I'll worry about a DX9 card and by then there should be much better ones around to choose from.

[zeradul]

I'm still waitin' for more of these DX8 ones to become available atm that were spose to be here by now. Maybe next year I'll worry about a DX9 card and by then there should be much better ones around to choose from.

Agreed. Its too bad there are so many crappy game companies. I mean, UT2003 has the same minimum system requirements that Quake3 does, and Q3 came out in late 1999. Why did epic even bother with 2k3? Epics games are like 800 megahertz celerons in a world of 3 Ghtz P4's.

Not to mention the first UT, it didn't even need a GL capable card to play!

[minibubba]

Since a company makes a game that is flexible enough to handle both low-end and high-end computers it is a "crappy game companies"? It means that they can develop a flexible game that anyone can enjoy. What is so crappy about that? I think it is a shame that new games often require people to buy new hardware just to get the game to load, which can effectively add several hundred dollars to the cost of a game. Tell me, what game is worth $300?

It sounds to me that your personal dislike for a certain game and/or company is seriously clouding your judgment.

[zeradul]

It may seem that way, but I assure you that is not the case.

Q1, Q2, Q3, D3 are (or were) each worth 300$. Easy. This may not be the case in Australia, and (some areas of) Europe where the internet is still fairly weak. But in the US and Canada, we can ping almost everywhere in the continent at under 50ms, causing these games to be but an engine for an onslaught of user made multiplayer mods.

Gaming Bliss, that most people have never experienced and some don't even believe exist. iD knows what they are doing. There is no way a single company can put out 50 top notch mods, and then stick around for 4 years to trouble shoot bugs and updates. But give this opportunity to people who have the time and desire, (and who do it for FREE out of the love of the game) and you get phenomonal mods whose level of competition is so far above and beyond all other forms of similar games.

Some people get mad when I tell them that single player (First Person Shooters) is absolute filth in comparrison, but that is simply because they don't know what is out there.

Games that are behind the times and cater to all machines made within 3-4 years old DO have their place... They are the training wheels of the game genre, but let me also point out that Q3 still has a hoard of Mods going which are still a better alternative than UT2K3 (IMO) because these mods have been tweaked to the max, which means weapons are balanced for each mod, speed and speed tweaks like RJ's and Combined acceleration are better, because they have been tweaked to Improve gameplay. Every weapon in Q3 is VERY deadly, but ONLY if you have mastered its use. Epic still struggles with their weapons, some are horribly useless, and others are just newbie weapons that take NO ability to use effectively. These are two good indicators of a game that does not offer the fullest exent of competition.

For me its all about separating skill and minimzing luck. And thats what you want in any competition. Luck based games get old FAST, E.G. Yatzee

[webe3]

Since a company makes a game that is flexible enough to handle both low-end and high-end computers it is a "crappy game companies"? It means that they can develop a flexible game that anyone can enjoy. What is so crappy about that? I think it is a shame that new games often require people to buy new hardware just to get the game to load, which can effectively add several hundred dollars to the cost of a game. Tell me, what game is worth 0?

It sounds to me that your personal dislike for a certain game and/or company is seriously clouding your judgment.

I agree completely! It sounds as though he wants games only to be made for the higest end system available...that's OK if you are a millionaire and can replace your setup regularly....but most have to make do with what they have! Most people cannot afford to go out and buy a new vid card or MB and CPU when the newest game is out! I know I can't! So why not make it available to as many people as possible? Personally, i don't see anything wrong with that!

[webe3]

It may seem that way, but I assure you that is not the case.

Q1, Q2, Q3, D3 are (or were) each worth 300$. Easy. This may not be the case in Australia, and (some areas of) Europe where the internet is still fairly weak. But in the US and Canada, we can ping almost everywhere in the continent at under 50ms, causing these games to be but an engine for an onslaught of user made multiplayer mods.

Gaming Bliss, that most people have never experienced and some don't even believe exist. iD knows what they are doing. There is no way a single company can put out 50 top notch mods, and then stick around for 4 years to trouble shoot bugs and updates. But give this opportunity to people who have the time and desire, (and who do it for FREE out of the love of the game) and you get phenomonal mods whose level of competition is so far above and beyond all other forms of similar games.

Some people get mad when I tell them that single player (First Person Shooters) is absolute filth in comparrison, but that is simply because they don't know what is out there.

Games that are behind the times and cater to all machines made within 3-4 years old DO have their place... They are the training wheels of the game genre, but let me also point out that Q3 still has a hoard of Mods going which are still a better alternative than UT2K3 (IMO) because these mods have been tweaked to the max, which means weapons are balanced for each mod, speed and speed tweaks like RJ's and Combined acceleration are better, because they have been tweaked to Improve gameplay. Every weapon in Q3 is VERY deadly, but ONLY if you have mastered its use. Epic still struggles with their weapons, some are horribly useless, and others are just newbie weapons that take NO ability to use effectively. These are two good indicators of a game that does not offer the fullest exent of competition.

For me its all about separating skill and minimzing luck. And thats what you want in any competition. Luck based games get old FAST, E.G. Yatzee

Well a game MAY be worth $300.00 to you and you can pay that for all I care! But there is no WAY I would pay that much for a game! Also, SORRY, but you can down single player all you want, but to ME multiplayer isn't worth my time! You just seem to have something against single player games, which is fine if that is your opinion, but you won't change my mind on single player! I don't have the time to mess around with all those people who ***** cry and moan about a game!! I LIKE single player, the only one that I have to listen to complaining is ME! Personally, I don't think that multiplayer is worth it if you don't have a good (AND I MEAN GOOD) internet connection! BUT to get back on topic, I am going for a Ti 4200 8x for now...I can get an fx 5600 or better later on!

[zeradul]

that's OK if you are a millionaire and can replace your setup regularly.

Do you not buy a new system once every 3 years? Thats all it takes if you buy wisely. (This is what I Do!) But you missed the point.

For me its dissapointing to see UT come out with versions that are not giving the consumer anything new. Releasing a game that falls into the category, 'its all been done, and done better' certainly doesn't make it worth 50$

However, if they DID offer something new, like a clever map editor, or useful user modification interface, etc I would be all for it, no matter how graphically intensive it is, or who made it.


----

Here's what iD has going for them... By making games on the bleeding edge, they make something that will last. Q3 is still a major graphical standard that graphics cards are based on, and compare that to UT which was released at the same time, it was NEVER a standard of any kind. Q3 was used in RTCW, Mohaa, Star Wars Jedi Knight and others! UT was used in basically nothing.

And by having the reputation for releasing games that last iD has attracted all the non-profit mod makers. These mod makers know that time invested into coding a mod will NOT be wasted, and id caters to them by making their games EASY to mod. These are ALL reasons why id has MORE to offer with their games than any other FPS company.

And like I said before. Q3 is out and still kicking ass, so why remake it and call it UT2003. The answer is making the quick buck for the un-knowing consumer who (you're right) doesn't have the best computer.

[zeradul]

But there is no WAY I would pay that much for a game! Also, SORRY, but you can down single player all you want, but to ME multiplayer isn't worth my time!

And what mods have you played? And how long did you spend playing it?

but you won't change my mind on single player!

You're right, I won't. But I urge you to keep trying online multiplayer, and preferably an id based game. Keep in mind, i am talking strictly about First Person Shooters.

I don't have the time to mess around with all those people who ***** cry and moan about a game!! I LIKE single player, the only one that I have to listen to complaining is ME!

Your thought process is going in the right direction. Hence my reference that Epic's Games are the 'Training Wheels' of the game genre. Trying playing some of id's games user made mods and it will shock you, NOONE says anything, with the exception of continual conversation about the current state of the game "Incoming Quad" for example.

Personally, I don't think that multiplayer is worth it if you don't have a good (AND I MEAN GOOD) internet connection!

Where are you from? It is not hard at all in the US to get a decent connection. Any DSL or Cable will do ya. And it will only cost ya 25 - 45 $ in most places.

[zeradul]

Some people get mad when I tell them that single player (First Person Shooters) is absolute filth in comparrison, but that is simply because they don't know what is out there. -Zeradul

Did I call that one or what. Hehe ;)

[homeworld1031tx]

I agree completely! It sounds as though he wants games only to be made for the higest end system available...that's OK if you are a millionaire and can replace your setup regularly....but most have to make do with what they have! Most people cannot afford to go out and buy a new vid card or MB and CPU when the newest game is out! I know I can't! So why not make it available to as many people as possible? Personally, i don't see anything wrong with that!

I secondly agree completely, and Minibubba was right. Not everyone has a P4C 3.2 Radeon 9800, so the mana factures have to make games flexible. Also, if you want the game to be good, you can crank up the resolutions and settings. I personnally think that UT2K3 has really good graphics.

[minibubba]

Did I call that one or what. Hehe ;)

No you didn't. While online games can be fun, it can never beat a quality single player experience. The only exception to that is LAN Parties. I can only handle so much online gaming, the rampid immaturity is sickening. I do enjoy the challenge of playing against someone with a brain. But too often I find myself on servers where the immaturity, disrespect, and all too often racism, is so abundant that I can not convince myself to play online for days. Nearly any FPS that can be played online, I have played online and I still say that the best FPS experience is a high quality, well thought out single player game. Don't get me wrong, I do greatly enjoy playing online (usually) but it can never replace a good single player game.

[zeradul]

Response to Homeworld:

This is not a discussion about graphics. :wave: