Prime/OCCT/MemTest/FurMark/...-stable, but not in Games. Advice welcome.

[SirGlanceALot]

Hi people

Great Forum. Lots of knowledgeable people around. This is my first post here and I have a problem where I hope to get some input from you.

Let me describe my problem:

I have my system overclocked to an amount that is absolutely rock-stable with any stressing software I fire at it. But in Games, it fails. CTDs, even bluescreens or freezes. I've tested Assassin's Creed and Grand Theft Auto IV so far, they're both highly unstable when overclocked to a certain amount, and rock-solid when @ default settings.
So, the "unstableness" only occurs when playing games. The question is: Why?


Getting specific:

Hardware/Software
Board: GigaByte GA-P35-DS3 Rev 2.0 F14 bios
CPU: C2D E8400 (E0)
Cooler: Arctic Freezer 7 Pro
RAM: Transcend aXeRam DDR2 1066+ 2GB Kit *Overclocking Memory Modules*
GPU: Zotac GeForce 8800 GT (std Zotac clocks)
PSU: Seasonic S12II 430W
HDD: WD3200AAKS (Caviar Blue)
OS: Clean install of Windows XP SP3


Bios

Robust Graphics Booster___________ [Auto]
CPU Clock Ratio___________________ [9] 
Fine Clock Ratio__________________  +0.0
CPU Frequency _________________ 3.99GHz (444x9)
CPU Host Clock Control____________ [Enabled]
CPU Host Frequency (MHz)__________ [444] 
PCI Express Frequency (Mhz)_______ [100]
C.I.A. 2__________________________ [Disabled]
Performance Enhance_______________ [Standard]
System Memory Multiplier_(SPD)____ [2.40]
Memory Frequency(Mhz)_____800_____  1066
DRAM Timing Selectable___(SPD)____ [Manual]

CAS Latency Time________________ [5]
Dram RAS# to CAS# Delay_________ [5]
Dram RAS# Precharge Delay_______ [5]
Precharge Delay (tRAS)__________ [18]

ACT to ACT Delay (tRRD)__________ [Auto]
Rank Write to READ Delay_________ [Auto] 
Write to Precharge Delay_________ [Auto]
Refresh to ACT Delay_____________ [Auto]
Read to Precharge Delay__________ [Auto]
Static tRead Value_______________ [Auto]
Static tRead Phase Adjust________ [Auto]

System Voltage Control_______ [Manual]
DDR2 OverVoltage Control_____ [+0.3V] 
PCI-E OverVoltage Control____ [Normal] 
FSB OverVoltage Control______ [Normal] 
(G)MCH OverVoltage Control___ [Normal] 
CPU Voltage Control__________ [1.23750] (CPU-Z: 1,200v Idle / 1,168v Load -> Vdroop ~0,03v)

Limit CPUID Max. to 3.....................: [Disabled]
No-Execute Memory Protect.................: [Enabled]
CPU Enhanced Halt (C1E)...................: [Disabled]
CPU Thermal Monitor 2(TM2) ...............: [Disabled]
CPU EIST Function.........................: [Disabled]
Virtualization Technology.................: [Disabled]

Integrated Peripherals
Legacy USB Storage Detect__________________ [Disabled]

This is my setup. Stressed with the following so far:

[U]OC 4GHz (above settings)[/U]

Prime95 Small FFTs_________________________ 17h [COLOR="SeaGreen"]no errors[/COLOR]
Prime95 Blend______________________________ 14h [COLOR="SeaGreen"]no errors[/COLOR]
Prime95 Blend + FurMark simultaneously_____ 13h [COLOR="SeaGreen"]no errors[/COLOR]

OCCT (CPU: OCCT) Auto (1h) | Medium Data Set | priority NORMAL___________ [COLOR="SeaGreen"]no errors[/COLOR]
OCCT (CPU: OCCT) Auto (1h) | Medium Data Set | priority HIGH_____________ [COLOR="SeaGreen"]no errors[/COLOR]
OCCT (CPU: Linpack) Auto (1h) | Max______________________________________ [COLOR="SeaGreen"]no errors[/COLOR]
OCCT (Power Supply) Auto (1h) | Shader complexity 0______________________ [COLOR="SeaGreen"]no errors[/COLOR]
OCCT (Power Supply) Auto (1h) | Shader complexity 8______________________ [COLOR="SeaGreen"]no errors[/COLOR]

MemTest86+ BootCD all tests___________ 8h [COLOR="SeaGreen"]no errors[/COLOR]
MemTest86+ BootCD Test #5_____________ 20 passes [COLOR="SeaGreen"]no errors[/COLOR]

3DMark06 default settings_____________ [COLOR="SeaGreen"]no errors[/COLOR]
3DMark06 1680x1050 highest settings___ [COLOR="SeaGreen"]no errors[/COLOR]

Grand Theft Auto IV__________ [COLOR="Red"]Random crashes within minutes[/COLOR]: mostly CTD. rarely BSOD nv4_disp.dll.
Assassin's Creed_____________ [COLOR="Red"]Random crashes[/COLOR]: mosaic-type freeze, blue-violettish colors.


[U]Non-OC[/U]

Grand Theft Auto IV__________ [COLOR="SeaGreen"]no errors[/COLOR]
Assassin's Creed_____________ [COLOR="SeaGreen"]no errors[/COLOR]

The type of crashes, especially the occurence of nv4_disp.dll might lead one to think of faulty drivers/GPU. This is NOT the case as seen below. No artifacts anywhere.

What I've tested so far to get the games stable:

Different GPU & drivers_________________________ [COLOR="Red"]no improvement[/COLOR]
Increased CPU Voltage Control___________________ [COLOR="Red"]no improvement[/COLOR]
Increased FSB OverVoltage Control_______________ [COLOR="Red"]no improvement[/COLOR]
Increased (G)MCH OverVoltage Control____________ [COLOR="Red"]no improvement[/COLOR]
Increased FSB & (G)MCH OverVoltage Control______ [COLOR="Red"]no improvement[/COLOR]
Increased DDR2 OverVoltage Control______________ [COLOR="Red"]no improvement[/COLOR]
Loosened RAM Timings____________________________ [COLOR="Red"]no improvement[/COLOR]
Different RAM Modules___________________________ [COLOR="Red"]no improvement[/COLOR]
Clocked down to 3.6 GHz_________________________ [COLOR="SeaGreen"]seems stable[/COLOR] (2h-3h hours GTAIV without crash)

*GPU drivers were correctly installed/uninstalled with DriverSpeeper/DriverCleanerPro.

Furthermore I can exclude the following:

I don't understand why games won't do properly but Prime/OCCT/FurMark/3DMark06 pass without problems. As stated, if I clock down to 3.6 GHz GTAIV seems stable. I don't understand it why it's not at 4GHz. It seems that Games don't like my processor running too high even if it passes those stressing-software, for whatever reason. It's fine at 444 FSB with lower multi, but hangs at higher multi when the CPU clock is too high. That annoys me as I don't understand it.

Maybe a different Motherboard would help? But I see no point why that would do.

Maybe someone has an idea what else could be the problem here?

Any advice would be great. I'd really appreciate it. Been trying for the past days (weeks!) without success. I'm at a loss.

Thanks for reading.

Hope I did everything right with my first post

[Lsdmeasap]

Re: Prime/OCCT/MemTest/FurMark/...-stable, but not in Games. Advice welcome.

Your increase of voltages does not mean the driver is not to blame, from your latter quotes I mean.

It is the driver that is failing, but why we don't know.

So how long have you ran furmark, and at what resolution? Just trying to see if maybe you didn't run furmark long enough to see the problem or did not run it at a large enough resolution.

How soon does the problem occur in the games? Do you have other games and it only affect these, if so it could just exactly be the drivers and issues with these games alone that happens often.

What tRD are you getting from Auto? You can check with memset, often Auto sets this too low. Could be an issue, but not likely from your stability testing.

[SirGlanceALot]

Re: Prime/OCCT/MemTest/FurMark/...-stable, but not in Games. Advice welcome.

So how long have you ran furmark, and at what resolution?

Prime95 Blend + FurMark simultaneously_____ 13h no errors

default settings & resolution: 1280x1024

How soon does the problem occur in the games?

Grand Theft Auto IV__________ Random crashes within minutes

Assassin's Creed: Hm sometimes within minutes, sometimes I can play an hour before it crashes.

Do you have other games...

Yes I do, but only tested those two so far. I'll try others.

...if so it could just exactly be the drivers and issues with these games alone that happens often.

hm, but that doesn't explain why they run smooth @ Non-OC. And then again, I've tested different driver-versions.

What tRD are you getting from Auto?

Performance Level: 10
Horrible I know, that'll be tweaked once my games are stable ;)

Thank you very much for your immediate first aid, Lsdmeasap! Top-notch!

[Lsdmeasap]

Re: Prime/OCCT/MemTest/FurMark/...-stable, but not in Games. Advice welcome.

Sorry I can't be of much help though!

I am not sure what this could be caused by, other than the driver/game combo. I know it doesn't happen at stock, which may or may not mean your overclock fails causing this, it could still be the driver.

How much were you increasing Vcore and MCH during your tests? With only 2GB much MCH would not be needed, but you may have just not been using enough Vcore possibly?

[SirGlanceALot]

Re: Prime/OCCT/MemTest/FurMark/...-stable, but not in Games. Advice welcome.

vCore raised till 1.35, nothing helps. Seeing that Prime Small FFTs runs for 17h errorfree at 1.23750 this should be no vCore problem.

raised MCH and FSB OverVoltage +0.1 and +0.2 both independent and simultaneously. nothing helps.

Thanks, Lsdmeasap. I know this is a tough one. Guess I'll try some other games and drivers then and report back.

[Lsdmeasap]

Re: Prime/OCCT/MemTest/FurMark/...-stable, but not in Games. Advice welcome.

1.35 at what overclock? Ya though, you are right since prime works for that long at 1.23, I just wanted to be sure you maybe werent just really close and needed a slight bump.

Yes, please do checkout some other games and see if you find the same.

Have any ATI Cards?

[SirGlanceALot]

Re: Prime/OCCT/MemTest/FurMark/...-stable, but not in Games. Advice welcome.

been going from 1.23750 up to 1.35 at the same clock. at first slight bumps, then big steps only to see that it wouldn't help.

No ATI card :/
Just another Nvidia (9400GT) where I experience the same issues.

[Lsdmeasap]

Re: Prime/OCCT/MemTest/FurMark/...-stable, but not in Games. Advice welcome.

Ahh ok, just thought I'd check.

Well try a few other games at overclocks and see if they act the same or not.

[SirGlanceALot]

Re: Prime/OCCT/MemTest/FurMark/...-stable, but not in Games. Advice welcome.

news:

Crysis_______________________ ~2h [COLOR=SeaGreen]no errors[/COLOR]
Street Fighter 4_____________ One playthrough on super hard [COLOR=SeaGreen]no errors[/COLOR]
Pro Evolution Soccer 6_______ ~2h [COLOR=SeaGreen]no errors[/COLOR]

After playing PES6 and while watching a scene (.avi video file) I've recorded with fraps -> BSOD IRQL_NOT_LESS_OR_EQUAL STOP: 0x0000000A

Hummmmm.....

EDIT: of course, all that with the same OC settings.

[Lsdmeasap]

Re: Prime/OCCT/MemTest/FurMark/...-stable, but not in Games. Advice welcome.

So it seems to me that is is either this card, or brand, or drivers not getting along with certain things is all.

Do you concur?

[SirGlanceALot]

Re: Prime/OCCT/MemTest/FurMark/...-stable, but not in Games. Advice welcome.

hm yeah in a way. seeing that my other 9400GT has the same issue the card itself should not be the problem, maybe brand. hope to get an ATI soon to test that.

what i'm going to test beforehand:
1. Driver update of all parts
2. bios downgrade F14->F13
3. mainboard from my other pc (p35-ds3R) -> oh man i'm really not in the mood for that one. the "problem pc" is in an htpc-case and the cables are beautifully hidden which will take quite some time to get there again.

and if those 3 not improve things, which I think they don't, then I guess I have no other chance than to try an ATI and see if that makes a difference.

again, i do not understand why this problem is only present when doing OC. I mean if the card/driver/brand really is the culprit wouldn't it also cause problems @ stock?

Oh my, so far in computing I always found causality when facing problem. But this really annoys me, hope to find the culprit.

[SirGlanceALot]

Re: Prime/OCCT/MemTest/FurMark/...-stable, but not in Games. Advice welcome.

hm GTA4 and Assassin's Creed use SecuRom. Crysis not. I can't imagine that's the cause but who knows. SF4 is SecuRom too but maybe haven't played that long enough. will try that longer and also Batman: Arkham Asylum.

[Lsdmeasap]

Re: Prime/OCCT/MemTest/FurMark/...-stable, but not in Games. Advice welcome.

Well the driver could only cause issues at high clocks were things are being pushed.

Try out 101-103 PCIE freq with your overclock and see if that helps, might fix it right up.

[SirGlanceALot]

Re: Prime/OCCT/MemTest/FurMark/...-stable, but not in Games. Advice welcome.

will do that and report back. if it does the trick i'll kiss your ass (well figuratively ^.^).

[Lsdmeasap]

Re: Prime/OCCT/MemTest/FurMark/...-stable, but not in Games. Advice welcome.

HAHA, well good luck!

I'll see ya tonight, heading out shortly