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Thread: Battle Between Nvidia and ATI




  1. #21
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    Jan 2003
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    106

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    i'd either go for the 9800 pro or wait for 9900(if it comes) for sure the 5800 doesn't beat the 9800 pro.....and after the 5200-5800 crappy ass nvidia cards..........i'd stay with radeon. i've played lots of games with a radeon 7500 and a radeon 9500 and never had any probs in any game.
    My rig:
    amd athlon xp 2500+ barton core @2.16GHZ (180mhz 12x)
    cooler master x-dream(with cooler master high performance thermal compound)
    mobo: asus a7n8x deluxe
    512mb of ddr pc-3200
    radeon 9500 pro
    pctv tuner card
    antec 5.1 speakers
    antec case with 5 80mm fans
    430 watts psu
    15" monitor @ 1024*768 32bit 70hz
    48x cd-rom, 52x24x52x cdrw
    2x 160gbs 7200 rpm 8mb buffer maxtor hdd
    win xp pro with sp1a
    all drivers updated

    "They say that when you run a Microsoft CD backwards you can hear demonic voices... But that's nothing - When you run it forwards it installs Windows"

  2. #22
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
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    3,141

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    Quote Originally Posted by PersianImmortal
    in virtually ever other benchmark the 9800 Pro either comes within 1-2fps or beats the 5900 Ultra, especially with high AA/AF.
    Bull****, but hey buy whatever you want it's your worries.

    After all you will be able to use the first pci slot which so many of us builders do.. Hope it works better for you than it does for quite a few people around who wanted to save $10.. :devil win

  3. #23
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    Apr 2002
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheOne™
    for sure the 5800 doesn't beat the 9800 pro.....
    Were talking about the new gpu 5900 Ultra here and not the 5800 but go for whatever feels right, good luck..

  4. #24
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    Jul 2002
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    Canberra, Australia
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    As evidence of what I said before, check out Tom's comparison of the various top-end cards here. Note the 9800 Pro (both 128MB and 256MB) equal or beat the 5900 Ultra at all res in Splinter Cell for example. Check the Codecreatures comparison too, note the 1-2fps difference max. Now in the popular benchmarks like 3Dmark2003 and UT2003, the 5900 Ultra is way ahead. Strange huh? Could it be "optimizations?"

    On the topic of Nvidia vs ATI cheating, which is worse and by how much, read this by Unwinder. He knows more about graphics than you and I put together.

    Here's a comparo of the two cards at OCAddiction showing for example that at very high resolution and high AA/AF (and don't say people don't use it because I do at that res) the 9800 Pro beats the 5900 clearly in UT2003. In Aquamark the 9800 Pro again beats the 5900 pro, as well as in 3DMark01. Note the strangely high result for the Nvidia card in 3Dmark03 and read the editors comments. His conclusion?:
    And the winner is.........The FIC ATi Radeon 9800 Pro 128MB. We compared these cards in every category we could think of and in the end, we saw better performance overall from the ATI Radeon 9800 Pro.
    There are many others like this, so please if you're going to call bull****, back it up with facts or at least tell everyone that you're guessing about stuff :blah:

    Note I didn't even go into how the ATI's Image Quality is much better to boot, not to mention noise, heat and size.

    The fact is in Australia I got my 9800 Pro for $720 as opposed to $980 for the 5900 Ultra, a 36% price difference. Also think of the fact that if the card takes up 2 slots, it is closer to the card in the 2nd PCI slot (in my case the soundcard) which is not good for either cards in terms of heat. The 5900 Ultra is a good card, but I say the smart money is on the 9800 Pro. And the drivers haven't even been "optimized" yet for it!

  5. #25
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
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    about ati vs nvidia 3dmark03 optimizations are what they are.. simply optimizations. And both companies (or all video card companies) should not have made/make optimizations for such program because it defeats the program's purpose, to test cards in un-optimized form.

    now for games, that's different. Nvidia or Ati can optimize all they want (as long as no un-acceptable Image Quality degradation is present). Because after all, you want the game to run as fast as it can, while still looking good.

    well I think we can all agree that you should definitely buy a video card according to what games you (will be) play(ing)!

    I bought a 9500pro a few months back but now sold it (same price too.. cool!) because the newer games that came out (Unreal2, ut2k3, vice city, etc.. ) were still not as fun as... Counter-Strike!! yes, its old but it's still #1 in my book, so i'm using my good ol' Radeon 8500 LELE.


    edit: UT2 -> Unreal 2.

  6. #26
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    Jun 2003
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    I would have to agree with The Tweaker on this one.

    I have used Nvidia cards all my life and NEVER had a problem. Although I have never used an ATI, so I can't say much on that.

    I just know I have READ so much on problems with drivers and all kinds of other problems with ATI and having to reformat to just get the thing to work.

    With nVidia, I stick it in, load the drivers and in 10 min. I am playing the latest game out there.

    Chez
    SFlower/Kingwin TT-201AB-W 3 window 12 bay Black/Gold ~
    Antec 480Blue modded+UV blue sleeved-hshrink from Pc-perfomance
    A7V8X Deluxe Rev. 2.0 - 2500+ Barton ~ Aero 7+ OR TT 11 Xaser w/ TT fan tube
    MSI Ti4200-VTD8X 8X AGP w/Zalman h-pipe cooler ~ Geil 2 x 512 Cas 2.5 6-3-3-2t w/Blue HS
    WD120JB 7200 8mg Cache ~ Maxtor Quantum Fireball 60GB
    Lite-on 48x24x48x16x CDRW-DVD Black ~ Aopen 56x Cdrom Black
    Enermax 3.5" Fan controller A3FATR2 ~ Round UV Blue cables/Silver braid
    2x12” UV/Blacklight CC Sound/on-off/PCI switch ~ 2x12” Thtake Blue CC Sound/on-off/PCI sw
    ALL wires UV Blue sleeved + Hshrink - Cornea CT 1904 19" LCD BLk/Slvr ~ Microsoft™ Windows XP Pro

    Knowledge is POWER

  7. #27
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    Jan 2003
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    some ppl seem 2 have bad luck with radeons as opposed 2 other ppl:). am not sayin that nvidia is that bad cause i've only used an 8mbs version(vanta i think, 3 years ago), but with gfx 5200-5800 failure(even nvidia accepted it), the gfx 5900 seems to be up in some ways but still 2 expensive. but i haven't had any probs with radeons, i've never had to format my hdd because of driver problems or any sort.....i've had this hdd without being formatted for a year now and it still runs really good....updated drivers, still good. i don't play at really high res cause my monitor doesn't really support it + i play mostly fps games which makes the crosshair or aiming thing much smaller(even though on some games you could make it bigger).
    My rig:
    amd athlon xp 2500+ barton core @2.16GHZ (180mhz 12x)
    cooler master x-dream(with cooler master high performance thermal compound)
    mobo: asus a7n8x deluxe
    512mb of ddr pc-3200
    radeon 9500 pro
    pctv tuner card
    antec 5.1 speakers
    antec case with 5 80mm fans
    430 watts psu
    15" monitor @ 1024*768 32bit 70hz
    48x cd-rom, 52x24x52x cdrw
    2x 160gbs 7200 rpm 8mb buffer maxtor hdd
    win xp pro with sp1a
    all drivers updated

    "They say that when you run a Microsoft CD backwards you can hear demonic voices... But that's nothing - When you run it forwards it installs Windows"

  8. #28
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Posts
    1,661

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    NVIDIA DRIVER NEWS

    (04/07/03)

    Well, as most of you have heard by now, I will not be releasing any more Omega drivers for nvidia cards. I know this must come as a surprise for many since there are a lot of people who trust my work and know that I'm doing all of this to help people. This is what REALLY happened:
    I received an E-Mail from nvidia on June 17, it was from one of their attorneys, and he wanted to speak with me personally on the phone. The mail seemed friendly, but since it was coming from the nvidia law offices, I was worried of some kind of lawsuit because of my work. I called him after reading the mail, and he greeted me in a friendly tone, so my nerves started to calm down as soon as he told me that he only wanted to ask me a few questions. He started by telling me that many people filled complaints at nvidia because my drivers where "damaging" PCs and that people thought my drivers where approved by them since I had the nvidia logo on my page, so I corrected him and told him that I have a very clear statement on my page and in the driver installation that warned users about the drivers, that they where not supported by nvidia in any way and in case of problems contact me directly or through the forums. Then he told me that what I was doing was illegal, that I can't reverse engineer their drivers, because it was in the license agreement, so I explained to him that I never did that, that I use registry tweaks and dll swaps to make the drivers work like I wanted, then I used settings and patch scripts that are freely available in tweakers like RivaTuner, plus I add some others that are of my own creation, like the custom resolutions and DirectX optimizations, and at the end I just packed all that work in one simple installer and distributed it freely on the internet. After my explanation the only thing he had against me was the nvidia logo on my page, so he told me that I must remove it immediately because people would get confused an think that my drivers are official nvidia drivers, so I told him that there is no problem, the logo will go. He thanks me and asks my phone number because they will be contacting me again, so I gave him my number and thank him for his time.
    After that I removed the logo and didn't heard from them again, I was gonna continue to make the drivers, but had my doubts...

    Then, just a few days ago, I got an E-Mail from Zardon telling me that nvidia E-Mailed him about my drivers, and told him to REMOVE THE DRIVERS FROM DRIVERHEAVEN...
    Now that does it! One thing is contacting me about my drivers and asking me to stop working on them, another is to force websites to take down the drivers which they host as a favor to the community.
    Right now I'm really pissed of at nvidia for that thing alone, first the cheats, then buying Futuremark's statement and now, Take down 3rd party sets that help them by making their customers happy? What's wrong with them!? They think money can buy anything?
    They are in the wrong track, they just want to cover all that bad press that they have been receiving lately by buying trust, but TRUST is not something they can buy, is something they must EARN! Gamers know that, they are no fools, maybe they can convince some old guy sitting in a president chair about it, showing him big numbers in synthetic benchmarks and showing their financial year gains, but they can't fool US:

    WE are the ones that buy their cards.
    WE are the ones that play the games.
    WE are the ones that support each other in forums when something goes wrong.
    WE are the ones that make their hardware reviews.
    WE are the ones that they should listen.
    WE are the ONLY ones, that can make a difference...

    See ya! nvidia....

    Sorry to all who supported my work, may GOD bless you all...


    ATI DRIVER NEWS

    (04/07/03)

    On the other hand, there is ATI...

    In the beginning, their drivers left much to be desired. When I bought my Radeon 8500 half of the things didn't worked and it was not working as advertised, that was a bad step for ATI. But unlike nvidia, they listened to their customers and with each driver release, things got better and better, fixing little by little all those holes, errors and memory leaks, to the point where the Catalyst drivers are right now, a point where they are almost bug free, at least is really difficult for me to spot bugs anymore...
    Then ATI goes a step further and creates a BETA testing community where all member report bugs directly to the driver programmers and hardware engineers, a plus for "normal" tech support and one that encourages trust and the shows the company's dedication to their users.
    I must personally thank Terry (Catalyst Maker) for his trust in my work, for noticing that I do this to help people, for his personal help and for letting me be part of the excellent Catalyst's Elite Beta Testing Group.

    Many thanks for your support and may GOD bless you all...

    Remember that I do this as a free service to make life more enjoyable for gamers

  9. #29
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Posts
    195

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    WETA,

    Do you have any driver tweaks for my new MSI card listed in my signature that I can download before I can't find them anymore.
    I am relatively new to this forum and have no clue as to where to find them.
    I would appreciate it.

    Thanks,
    Chez
    SFlower/Kingwin TT-201AB-W 3 window 12 bay Black/Gold ~
    Antec 480Blue modded+UV blue sleeved-hshrink from Pc-perfomance
    A7V8X Deluxe Rev. 2.0 - 2500+ Barton ~ Aero 7+ OR TT 11 Xaser w/ TT fan tube
    MSI Ti4200-VTD8X 8X AGP w/Zalman h-pipe cooler ~ Geil 2 x 512 Cas 2.5 6-3-3-2t w/Blue HS
    WD120JB 7200 8mg Cache ~ Maxtor Quantum Fireball 60GB
    Lite-on 48x24x48x16x CDRW-DVD Black ~ Aopen 56x Cdrom Black
    Enermax 3.5" Fan controller A3FATR2 ~ Round UV Blue cables/Silver braid
    2x12” UV/Blacklight CC Sound/on-off/PCI switch ~ 2x12” Thtake Blue CC Sound/on-off/PCI sw
    ALL wires UV Blue sleeved + Hshrink - Cornea CT 1904 19" LCD BLk/Slvr ~ Microsoft™ Windows XP Pro

    Knowledge is POWER

  10. #30
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Posts
    1,661

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    chezman: What MSI card do you have, and what software are you looking for? (Sorry but I've got the signatures turned off)

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